Helen Cheyne born Kintore 1886 ** birthday bumped post **

Looking for Scottish Ancestors

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imlincs
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Post by imlincs » Fri Oct 24, 2008 6:06 pm

Hello Annette

According to the inscription on the back Aunt Maggie is the one on the left and I'm sure the lady with my mother is the same person. It looks (doesn't it?) as though she is not wearing a wedding ring which would tie in with what we have been discussing.

In the light of what I've learned on this site over recent weeks, it seems likely to me that some, if not all, of the others in the photo are members of the Simpson family we have been looking at, probably photographed in Aberdeen. Otherwise why would my grandmother have kept it?

Ian
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imlincs
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Post by imlincs » Fri Oct 24, 2008 6:14 pm

Hello Sarah

Your example does cite the deceased as being Aunt of John Geroge Carter, so citing children does not seem out of the question. Perhaps Alan may know.

Ian
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Currie
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Post by Currie » Sat Oct 25, 2008 12:53 pm

Hello Ian,

Sorry I’m a bit late in responding. I’ve been preoccupied with some things that had to be done. I really should have included direct links to each of those newspaper index items I posted.

The death entry for Albert Sansum and the extra entry in his wife’s maiden name were on this index http://www.elginogs.ca/newsindexes/aylm ... ru1964.htm and it seems to include other names only for the spouse of a death or parent of a birth.

The other index with Mrs Charles Matthews is from an entirely separate index done by different individuals and contains more of a summary of the notice and is here http://www.elginogs.ca/newsindexes/time ... hrudec.htm

I guess the amount of info that goes into a newspaper death notice would depend on local custom, affordability etc. The smaller the town or city probably increases the chances there will be more detail. I’m not really familiar with the Canadian situation but I would guess that a death notice that mentions a spouse by name would very likely also mention children by name although that may not extend to multitudes of grandchildren etc.

As indicated by Sarah the absence of other Sansum data in the indexes and the trips to Europe by just the two of them puts a bit of a black cloud over things but neither is conclusive. It looks like they were still in Belmont in 1948 but you can’t be sure with the 1962 death notice as they may have moved and inserted one in the newspaper of their old hometown.

Maybe there is some way of getting hold of a copy of the notice or at least the full transcription from some one on the spot at http://www.elginogs.ca/ or whatever. There may be information about that somewhere on the site.

All the best,
Alan

imlincs
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Post by imlincs » Mon Oct 27, 2008 7:48 pm

Hello again

A response I've had to an enquiry about Margaret Kennedy on another site has made an interesting point.

If MK had been the daughter of Mary Louisa Sansum (nee Simpson), is it likely she would she have referred to her cousin and the daughter of her aunt Susan Gatt Simpson as "Mrs Hossack's Kathleen")? The more so when she refers to the aunt of Mary Louisa and Susan Gatt Simpson as "Aunt Maggie".

Where does this Margaret Kennedy fit in?

Ian
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SarahND
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Post by SarahND » Mon Oct 27, 2008 8:18 pm

Hi Ian,
The various permutations of the story behind this thread are beginning to be difficult for my tiny mind to encompass, so forgive me if this has already been said, but... I think you need to get her death certificate and/or an obituary, to try to find out who she was. In your place, I would send a message to "ask a librarian" at the local public library in New Westminster:

http://www.nwpl.new-westminster.bc.ca/

Ask about an obituary, giving all the information you have. You may or may not be successful, depending on whether or not they have an index of obituaries (many local libraries do, at least in the States). Then, when you know the date of death, and assuming the obit doesn't give you the information you need, you can try to order the death cert (or isn't that possible in Canada? I'm forgetting, if I ever knew...

Good luck with this! If I were in my Idaho incarnation, I'd drive over and have a look for you (I'm curious too!)-- but I'm in France at the moment :roll:

All the best,
Sarah

imlincs
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Joined: Sat Sep 27, 2008 12:42 pm

Post by imlincs » Thu Oct 30, 2008 4:51 pm

Hello Sarah

Someone on the spot has very generously tracked Margaret's movements (and those of her husband John/Jack although he seems to have disappeared by 1982) across Vancouver between 1947 and 1982.

I'm a bit dubious about posting too much info on this in view of the rules about exposing living people (not that I've actually traced any living people but 1982 is getting quite close to the present and some of the questions that come to mind might involve that).

Am I allowed to post a link to another site that shows this info about MK?

Ian
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SarahND
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Post by SarahND » Thu Oct 30, 2008 5:35 pm

Hi Ian,
I guess the main point is, did any of this information get you any closer to knowing who she is, and how she fits into your family?

Regards,
Sarah

imlincs
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Post by imlincs » Thu Oct 30, 2008 6:13 pm

Hello Sarah

Only insofar as it could lead me to an obit or the possibility that someone in the area could provide info about MK, eg when/where she died (if indeed she's dead).

Ian
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SarahND
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Post by SarahND » Thu Oct 30, 2008 6:26 pm

Hi Ian,
Was she still in the Vancouver area at last sighting? If so, have you tried yet to contact the local library for an obit? And one last question :wink: have you found anything that would indicate her approximate year of birth?

Regards,
Sarah

nelmit
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Post by nelmit » Fri Oct 31, 2008 6:11 pm

AnneM wrote:In 1901 Nellie Cheyne born in Kintore is 14 and working as farm servant in Auchterless. The Auchterless connection just keeps growing stronger.

Sorry. Did not spot that you had already posted that information.

Pardon my nosiness but how did a farm servant from Auchterless get to London?

Anne
And living at the next household is William Simpson the miller with son Robert and his wife Susan along with Susan Gatt Simpson and William's daughter Maggie !!!!!!!
imlincs wrote:I have found a marriage in 1924 in St Nicholas, Aberdeen City between George Hossack and Susan Gatt Simpson. In 1901 Susan Gatt Simpson (and it’s difficult to believe that there were lots of them) aged 1 was living at Mill of Littlemile, Auchterless where her grandfather William Simpson aged 68 was “corn miller” assisted by his son Robert (37) who had been with him in 1871 but not 1881, according to Annette. Potential Aunt Maggie, Margaret Simpson now aged 23 is also there listed as a domestic servant rather than “daughter”. She would appear to be the right sort of age to be Aunt Maggie (or possibly great Aunt Maggie to Kathleen Hossack, Margaret Kennedy and my mother). Following up on Susan’s point about unmarried ladies being referred to as “missus” this would fit in with this version of Aunt Maggie too.
I can't believe we've not spotted this before. :shock:

I was at Park Circus today and looked up the death of our potential Aunt Maggie. Margaret Shand Simpson (Christina's half sister and Helen's half aunt ) She died at Aboyne in 1970 age 92 and unmarried. Father William Simpson a Miller and Elizabeth Shand. When I did a wee double check of the 1901 census to make sure I had the right lady there was wee Nellie right next door to the family at Easter Logie Milton!!!! :D

Just goes to show how different things look when viewing original documents. :D

So in my mind we very definitely have the correct Christina Simpson as mother of Helen Cheyne. I also think Aunt Maggie in the picture is Margaret Shand Simpson.

Regards,
Annette

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