Parish Bishop Transcripts and Session Records

[BobMitchell]

Hi

I have found my MItchell, Frazer, Clerkson, and Ritchie family ancestors in Wiston&Roberton and Carmichael Parishes in Lanark County. I have found them by reviewing the Old Parish Registers on Microfilm. I think there maybe other research tools available including Bishop Transcripts or Session Records for these parishes which may give me more information.

Does anyone have any information that could help me find other records?

Bob

[LesleyB]

Hi Bob
..and welcome to Talking Scot.

As far as I'm aware, "Bishop's Transcripts" can only be found in England. There are however, many Kirk Session records for Scottish parishes. These are availble to view at some local archives and at the National Archives of Scotland in Edinburgh. There are not on microfilm, as far as I'm aware, but there are plans to have then availbable online at some point. There are many other records such as sasines, hearth tax (late 1600s) and etc. again available at NAS. It may be worth checking what is available for those Lanarkshire parishes on the LDS site as they may have filmed some records in addition to the OPRs.

Best wishes
Lesley

[Montrose Budie]

Hi Bob

Some churches, mainly in cities, where there might be several church buildings, or more than one minister within the one ecclesiastical parish, kept two sets of registers. One seems to have been the records recorded on the spot by each minister, the other the "official" parish register when the records were transcribed into the single parochial register.

The former are often referred to as blotter registers and can contain minor differences.

mb

[Alan SHARP]

Hi mb.

Now that's very interesting I will keep that in mind when researching the Glasgow records for the lost SHARP'S. As you probably know here in NZ if it was recorded that the old folk were from Glasgow, it could have actually been any where within say twenty or more miles from the city centre. There were a large number of Parishes within that circle yet alone Churches.

Did the LDS photograph the BLOTTER COPIES as well ?

Regards Alan.

[LesleyB]

Alan
If you go to Scotlands People and choose, for an example, "Midlothian" as the area you are searching, from the list of available Parishes and scroll down you will see Canongate mentioned as "Blotter Reg" and "Scroll Reg". I do not know if the LDS filmed these - you would need to go to their web site and check the available films for any particular area of interest. (Not seeing any similar for Lanarkshire on there...but not sure if this means there are none at all, or just none filmed for GROS - again, check LDS site)

Best wishes
Lelsey

[Alan SHARP]

Thanks for that.
If I'm a bit slow to reply over the next couple of months it's not because I have lost interest in TS posts, but because I'm one of the committee who organize the largest Agricultural show in Australia, or New Zealand, called the NZ National Agricultural Fieldays, June 16 19.
Alan SHARP.

[Montrose Budie]

Hi mb.

Now that's very interesting I will keep that in mind when researching the Glasgow records for the lost SHARP'S. As you probably know here in NZ if it was recorded that the old folk were from Glasgow, it could have actually been any where within say twenty or more miles from the city centre. There were a large number of Parishes within that circle yet alone Churches.

Did the LDS photograph the BLOTTER COPIES as well ?

Regards Alan.

Hi Alan

It's always a problem when somewhere came from anywhere near a big city or large town. Not just parish names but also place names.

Let's face it, if you came from Auchenshuggle (it exists and is well known as a Glasgow tram terminus), where would you say you came from in answer to a question from the census enumerator in Canada, the USofA, Australia, or New Zealand?, - Auchenshuggle or Glasgow?


Some years ago, in the USA, I met a fellow Scot who told me she was from Aberdeen. Only in later conversation did it come out that she was actually from town of Banchory, 17 mls WSW of Aberdeen, and in a different county, forbye, but had become fed up during her years in the USA of having to explain where Banchory was, never mind the spelling, whereas a good number of people had heard of Aberdeen.


As far as I know the LDS have microfilmed the blotter registers that GROS have on microfilm. ("blotter" in the terminology of the time = "draft".)

mb

[Montrose Budie]

I was having a browse and came across this earlier post -

QUOTE
Back in the days of the OPRs paper was a valuable source, - they'd be horrified to see how casually we treat paper today.

It was most often the case that a minister or session clerk would keep a rough copy of the details of proclamations, marriages, christenings etc., and then, every so often, write up the details in the actual OPR. Going off on a side-track, if you are unlucky the interval may have been long, - several months, - and his memory not just as good as he thought, so that his assumption that he would naturally recall the details that weren't originally written down turned out to be wrong!

The rough drafts sometimes survived and are generally known as scroll or blotter records; "blotter" from the terms used in counting houses to refer to a "waste" copy of a record book, or a rough draft of a letter. "Scroll" derives from a term used for duplicate records, for example where a minister kept a private record of events, i.e. not just a draft but a fair copy.

Apart from the above Aberdeen records, there are blotter marriage/proclamation records for Glasgow for 1815 to 1854; Barony for 1829 - 1854; Edinburgh St Cuthberts Births and Baptisms 1724 - 1850, and marriages 1744 - 1755 and 1768 - 1772; Edinburgh St Cuthberts again, scroll proclamations 1818 - 1855; Canongate kirk session treasurer's accounts including baptisms, marriage and mortcloth dues 1689 - 1693, plus Rev William Dun's private marriage register 1814 - 1822.

While not strictly speaking in the same category there are also records such as Jenat Thomson's Midwife Register of Births for Kilmarnock 1777 - 1829.

All of the above are in the custody of GROS at NRH.
ENDQUOTE

mb

[Alan SHARP]

Greetings mb

Thanks for your post. Your info has brought to mind when I first started researching the "Glasgow" records in 1982. I attended the Family Room at the LDS Temple and was given a period map of the parishes of the environs of Glasgow. From the FICHE records it was obvious that I needed to see the Cathcart and Eastwood films so as no one had previously asked to see those films, I was required to hand over NZ$ 3 and await their arrival from Utah. Viewing the original documents was the basis of my successful research, but when I set up the first roll of film in the reader I wondered what I had gotten into. The first page was gibberish to me.

The assistants could not help me, but I was so fascinated that I took a copy. I have noted at the top of the page I copied Cathcart 3156 - 102052 and also 102055 3465. So long ago I'm not sure of the meaning of these numbers.

The page had some 30 lines of what appear to be a scrawled short hand, then some numbers adding up to 288 with possibly some division as well and signed Alexander Baird. All faithfully recorded by the camera.

Alan SHARP

Edit: added "Alexander Baird'

[AndrewP]

I have noted at the top of the page I copied Cathcart 3156 - 102052 and also 102055 3465. So long ago I'm not sure of the meaning of these numbers.

102052 is the film number for the first filming of the OPRs for Cathcart.
102055 is the film number for the first filming of the OPRs for Eastwood.
The numbers in the 3000s may be frame numbers on these films.

All the best,

AndrewP