marshall - brickwall.....

Grace Carrick · Post by **Grace Carrick** » Sat Jul 08, 2006 8:25 pm

Anyone out there researching the Marshalls of Renfrewshire. I am desperate to find my ancestor Joseph Marshall who was a Sailor, birthplace. He married Helen Laird in Greenock in 1790. Two of his children were born there. Janet in 1794 and Joseph in 1792, the latter is my direct ancestor. He married Margaret Love of Kilmacolm and settled there, but have been unable to find out his fathers birthplace. He does not appear on the 1841 Renfrewshire Census and no monumental inscriptions exist. Would like to hear from anyone with Marshalls of Greenock in their ancestry.

Post by **Liz Turner** » Thu Aug 03, 2006 8:18 pm

Hi there Grace

This will be a tricky one to trace. Greenock would have been a small town back then, but growing. I had a look on the IGI and found these other marriages around the time of your one. Perhaps they could be related? Apologies if you've already got them.

Marshall, British Isles
Exact Spelling: Off
Batch Number: M115647

1. WILLIAM MARSHALL - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Marriage: 10 SEP 1774 Middle Or New Parish, Greenock, Renfrew, Scotland
2. MARGARET MARSHAL - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Marriage: 07 NOV 1777 Middle Or New Parish, Greenock, Renfrew, Scotland
3. ANNE MARSHAL - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Marriage: 25 JUL 1777 Middle Or New Parish, Greenock, Renfrew, Scotland
4. ALEXANDER MARSHALL OR MITCHELL - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Marriage: 08 NOV 1794 Middle Or New Parish, Greenock, Renfrew, Scotland
5. HELEN MARSHALL - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Marriage: 23 JAN 1819 Middle Or New Parish, Greenock, Renfrew, Scotland
6. JOSEPH MARSHALL - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Marriage: 02 APR 1790 Middle Or New Parish, Greenock, Renfrew, Scotland (your one)

Kilmacolm is not far from where I live and I was often there as a child for the weekly shopping when I was staying with my gran, who lived on an old farm between Bridge of Weir and Kilmacolm.

I wonder if your Joseph was a merchant seaman or a fisherman? If he married in 1790, he might have been around 25 or so - I wonder where he came from? Did he have any siblings you know of? Sometimes a sideways search can bear fruit.

Anyway - don't give up. This link might prove helpful if you don't know the area:- http://www.inverclyde.gov.uk/Libraries/ ... ition=54:1

Liz

JJ

Grace Carrick · Post by **Grace Carrick** » Tue Aug 08, 2006 8:15 pm

Hi Liz,
Many thanks for your reply. This Marshall line was my Grandmothers and I have been unable to get any further back than Joseph Marshall who married Janet Laird, the last entry on your list. I was only able to find one Joseph Marshall on official records, born around the time I think he may have been born and this was a Joseph born in Abercorn, however he married surname Hardie, so unless she died and he later married Helen Laird, that is unlikely to be the one. There are three other Joseph Marshalls born around the same period listed on the LDS site, one in Slamannan, the other two in West Lothian, but having contacted a Torphichan Marshall many moons ago that would appear to be a dead end. Of course he may not be Scottish, being a Sailor, he may just have visited Greenock. I don't really know what kind of sailor he was, but as many on the same page of his marriage appear to be naval, I can only think he might have been in th navy. A Joseph Marshall was bosun on the Orion Flagship at Trafalgar but the records show no age or place of birth, so the mystery goes on. I know there were other Marshalls in the area and I will check out some of the names you have listed, there may be a connection.

scml · Post by **scml** » Thu Aug 10, 2006 7:32 am

Dear Grace,

I don't think my lot would be linked to yours, but you never know. I haven't been able to get back to far yet as I am concentrating on the other side of my family but I have a few names who are from Paisley, Renfrewshire.

William Marshall b sometime late 1700's
son: George Marshall (carpet weaver) b 1824 Paisley
George married Elizabeth Gemmell on 6 Nov 1852 Low Parish Paisley.
Elizabeth was born 1 Mar 1825/26 Paisley
they had a son John Marshall b 1857, in either Scotland or Australia, though I think it is Scotland as I can't find him here. I would say he came out as a child around 1860 with his parents as the three death records are in Australia.

Grace Carrick · Post by **Grace Carrick** » Thu Aug 10, 2006 11:16 pm

Hi Sandy,
Thanks for your interest, and I can honestly say there could be some connection, as I have never found out exactly where Joseph Marshall was born. Its a funny thing but I have only been able to find two children, born to him and wife Helen Laird, at a time when large families were more common. Whether this indicates he was at sea a lot or not, who knows!. His son also called Joseph had a son William and his brother John Marshall, my Gt. Grandfather also named one of his two sons William, but he died when quite young, so William came into the tree somewhere?? There is a connection to Australia also, if you haven't looked, go into the Australia section forum, but this continues to be a mystery!!!!! I shall take a note of your names listed to add to mine and keep searching. Thanks anyway Sandy.

scml · Post by **scml** » Sat Aug 12, 2006 2:29 am

Hi Grace,
an update on my family as I spent most of the evening doing some more research on them. From FreeCen I have this family (which I am sure is mine) on the 1841 Census for Paisley Low:

[b]Marshall, William, M, 40, Hand Loom Weaver, Renfrewshire[/b]
Marshall, Isibella, F, 40, Outside Census County (1841)
Marshall, Wm, M, 20, Hand Loom Weaver, Outside Census County (1841)
Marshall, Margaret, F, 18, Renfrewshire
[b]Marshall, George, M, 15, Outside Census County (1841)[/b]
Marshall, John, M, 10, Outside Census County (1841)
Marshall, James, M, 5, Renfrewshire
Marshall, Mary, F, 10, Outside Census County (1841)
Marshall, Jane, F, 7, Renfrewshire
Marshall, Isabella, F, 1, Renfrewshire

Then on the 1851 Census for Paisley (Quoad Sacra Parish of: formerly South part of Low)
Page 15, No3 Neilson St

William Marshall, Head, Mar, 50, Hand Loom Weaver, Renfrew Paisley
Isabella Do , wife, Mar, 52, Midlothian Edinb
William Do , U, 30, Hand Loom Weaver, Midlothian Edinb
George Do , U, 27, Hand Loom Weaver, Midlothian Edinb
Jane Do , U, 17, Silk weaver Winder, Renfrew Paisley
James Do , U, 15, Block Cutter Printwork, Renfrew Paisley

No Joseph's I am afraid, but it gives another county for you to look at in Midlothian Edinb (is this Edinburgh?)

Now, I have a question for anyone who may be able to help???

The son George Marshall is my gt gt grandfather, and he married Elizabeth Gemmell. I sent away for the marriage records from on Scotlands People, and I received back their marriage banns. It has:
6 Nov 1852, George Marshall, 28, Carpet Weaver, L.P 3 Nelson Street, Elizabeth Gemmell, 26, L.P 4 Nelson Street
No of days Proclaimed III, Nov 7
but unfortunately in the Marriage column there is no further entry.

I was after the names of his parents to find Isabella's surname, so any suggestions on the best way to find this. If they sent out the Banns I guess there isn't further record ?? of the actual marriage. And there is no surname for her on the census forms, and I haven't found births yet.
There is a family group on family search, but whereas the names all fit, the births are all out by 10 to 15 years. And Isabella is referred to as Mrs Isabella Marshall. It has a Film No 456868 which I guess shows it a proper records, or could it be submitted by a member, as now I am totally confused.
Any help would be great.

And good luck with your search Grace I will also keep an eye out for your lot.

StewL · Post by **StewL** » Sat Aug 12, 2006 3:11 am

Sandy

You could start out with doing a DC search for Elizabeth/Isabella using both her married name and maiden name. With a bit of luck there may be her parents named on the DC. Then you could look to see if she was noted as married or a widow, which could lead you to his DC.

I did a search using the name Isabella from 1855-1935 and only came up with one result, but credits have expired. I did not specify any location during this search.

Grace Carrick · Post by **Grace Carrick** » Sat Aug 12, 2006 2:44 pm

Hi Sandy,
Many thanks for the further info., however, I'm not sure there is a connection, but you never know, its all worth taking a note of. The names that seem to run in the family, ie. Joesph Marshall, jnr. sons and daughters were:- Helen, Joseph, John, William (two children named that, one dying young) Walter, Margaret, Janet, Grace, Mary and unusually Martin. I haven't found any George's or Isabells, bearing in mind some children were named after aunts and uncles. Will just have to keep searching, maybe someone will come up with the answer. Thanks again Sandy and good luck with your searches.

Davie · Post by **Davie** » Sat Aug 12, 2006 7:10 pm

Hi Grace,
I cannot help much on the Marshall side, but have several Gemmils on file, mosly from Glasgow though.
However. have a few death records on file with a Marshall husband.
Elizabeth d 1952 aged 78
Elizabeth d 1955 aged 79
Isabella d 1867
And
Margaret 1878 in West Kilbride, aged 80, which I have the cert of.
Davie.

scml · Post by **scml** » Sun Aug 13, 2006 12:55 am

Hi Davie,

Reading your post, I was wondering if you have any info on the parents of my Elizabeth Gemmell (Gemmill) b 1 Mar 1825. They were John Gemmell and Isabella Kincaide (Kincaid)

I also have two Isabella Marshalls, one born about 1799 and married to William Marshall sometime before 1821. I dont have her maiden name.
And their daughter Isabella born 1840. What age was the Isabella who died in 1867?

Any little bits of info would be great