Army Pensioner/Suspicous Death

[Rodeo]

I have searched the NAS online catalogue in vain for one of my forebears who was found dead, aged 39, in 1907. The examining physician attributed his death 'most probably to heart disease', although I await receipt of the RCE. His death certificate records his occupation as army pensioner. Presumably, he suffered an injury in the Boer War, although I have thus far been unable to confirm this. As his father was also in the military, it seems reasonable to assume that the reason he was an army pensioner was as a result of combat. However, it could possibly have been for a medical reason.

How can I verify this?

Is there a searchable online index of Scottish army pensioners pre-World War I? Also, is anyone aware of a comprehensive searchable online muster roll of Scots in the Boer War?

Any help would be most appreciated. I'm absolutely flummoxed, as all my online searches have thus far proved futile.

Cheers,

Rodeo

[DavidWW]

I have searched the NAS online catalogue in vain for one of my forebears who was found dead, aged 39, in 1907. The examining physician attributed his death 'most probably to heart disease', although I await receipt of the RCE.

What's his name?, and can you post a copy of the death register entry here, please?.

There are several reasons for an RCE .

One is to correct an error of fact. The comment 'most probably to heart disease' could mean that the doctor who certified death hadn't seen your forbear before death, in which case, quite correctly, the death was reported to the Procurator Fiscal.

The other main one is if there was no regular medical attendant before death.

If that is the case then all that the RCE contains will be confirmation of the cause of death by a doctor working on behalf of the PF.

His death certificate records his occupation as army pensioner. Presumably, he suffered an injury in the Boer War, although I have thus far been unable to confirm this. As his father was also in the military, it seems reasonable to assume that the reason he was an army pensioner was as a result of combat. However, it could possibly have been for a medical reason.

How can I verify this?

Is there a searchable online index of Scottish army pensioners pre-World War I? Also, is anyone aware of a comprehensive searchable online muster roll of Scots in the Boer War?

Yes, but not yet for as late on as a soldier who served in the Boer War. Do you know his regiment?

David

[Rodeo]

Hello, David. Thanks so much for your reply to my query. My ancestor's name is Peter Yule, who died on 19 April 1907 at 5 Bothwell Road, Hamilton, aged 39. The cause of death was 'heart disease (probably), as certified by T. Steele M.B.C. M., who examined the body.' The informant was Margaret Paterson, sister, The Cottage, Bothwell Road, Hamilton. The marginal entry (RCE) reads: 'See Reg. of Corr. Entries Vol 10, Page 97, 1907 May 3rd'.

Yes, I know that an RCE may contain merely a confirmation of the cause of death with no further elucidating information but I am hopeful that the RCE in this case may make reference to a previous injury for which the deceased received an army pension. Perhaps I'm being too optimistic.

No, I have no idea in which regiment he may have served in the Boer War. I merely assumed that he served in the Boer War and, as a result of a wound, became a pensioner. It seems to me a reasonable assumption but, on the other hand, I could be leaping to a wrong conclusion (as one does genealogically).

Thanks again, David.

Cheers,

Rodeo

[DavidWW]

Hello, David. Thanks so much for your reply to my query. My ancestor's name is Peter Yule, who died on 19 April 1907 at 5 Bothwell Road, Hamilton, aged 39. The cause of death was 'heart disease (probably), as certified by T. Steele M.B.C. M., who examined the body.' The informant was Margaret Paterson, sister, The Cottage, Bothwell Road, Hamilton. The marginal entry (RCE) reads: 'See Reg. of Corr. Entries Vol 10, Page 97, 1907 May 3rd'.

The phrase 'who examined the body' reinforces my opinion that Peter YULE died of a heart condition not previously known or treated by a doctor, - in other words, Dr. T. Steele M.B., C.M., only examined the body after death, but had not previously treated Peter YULE as a patient prior to the death of Peter YULE.

Yes, I know that an RCE may contain merely a confirmation of the cause of death with no further elucidating information but I am hopeful that the RCE in this case may make reference to a previous injury for which the deceased received an army pension. Perhaps I'm being too optimistic.

I'd very much suspect that you are indeed being too hopeful, but can only wait to see what further info that the RCE entry provides.

No, I have no idea in which regiment he may have served in the Boer War. I merely assumed that he served in the Boer War and, as a result of a wound, became a pensioner. It seems to me a reasonable assumption but, on the other hand, I could be leaping to a wrong conclusion (as one does genealogically).

Any soldier who survived his period of service, wounded or otherwise, automatically became a Chelsea or Kilimainham (the Irish version of "Chelsea") pensioner.

But only a very small proportion of such pensioners were "In-Pensioners" at the "hospitals" at Chelsea and Kilmainham, as opposed to being classified as "out pensioners", living at home, and receiving an Army pension.

All sojers who survived to receive a pension became Chelsea or Kilmainham pensionsers.

David

[HeatherH]

Hello Rodeo,
When and where was Peter born if you know?
HeatherH

[Rodeo]

Thanks for your help, David. It's much appreciated.

Hi, Heather. Peter Yule was born on 9 May 1867 in Hamilton, Scotland.

Cheers,

Rodeo

[HeatherH]

Hello Rodeo,
The only record I could find reference to pre WW1 for a pensioner at the archives was for a ...
Name Yule, Peter
Official Number: 209547
Place of Birth: Kingoodie, Perthshire
03 December 1882

Not your Peter.I was hopful as I had found records for 2 of my rellies using this search last week.
I'll keep you in mind if I come across any other resources.
All the best,
HeatherH

[Rodeo]

Thanks very much for that Heather. I appreciate it.

Cheers,

Rodeo

[DavidWW]

Here's wee Peter and family in 1881 ..........

Institution: "Soldiers Barracks" Hamilton
Census Place: Hamilton, Lanark, Scotland
Source: FHL Film 0203693 GRO Ref Volume 647 EnumDist 28 Page 4
Marr Age Sex Birthplace
Peter YULE M 55 M England
Rel: Head
Occ: Chelsea Pensioner Staff 1st Royal Lanark Militia
Annie YULE M 43 F Smitholm ?, Roxburgh, Scotland
Rel: Wife
James YULE U 15 M Hamilton, Lanark, Scotland
Rel: Son
Occ: Apprentice Joiner
Peter YULE U 13 M Hamilton, Lanark, Scotland
Rel: Son
Occ: Apprentice Plumber
Margaret YULE 12 F Hamilton, Lanark, Scotland
Rel: Daughter
Occ: Scholar
Thomas YULE 10 M Hamilton, Lanark, Scotland
Rel: Son
Occ: Scholar
John YULE 8 M Hamilton, Lanark, Scotland
Rel: Son
Occ: Scholar
William YULE 5 M Hamilton, Lanark, Scotland
Rel: Son
Occ: Scholar
Charles YULE 3 M Hamilton, Lanark, Scotland
Rel: Son
Adam YULE 1 M Hamilton, Lanark, Scotland
Rel: Son
Margaret YULE W 71 F Humbie, Edinburgh, Scotland
Rel: Mother

Peter doesn't appear in the 1891 or 1901 censuses for Scotland so may be in the army.

Note his father's connection with the 1st Royal Lanarkshire Militia. They were associated with The Scottish Rifles (Cameronians), often just known as the Cameronians.

It's most likely, although not certain, that Peter served in this regiment as well. If he did, you can see where he served at http://www.regiments.org/deploy/uk/reg-inf/026-1.htm

Again, if he did serve with this regiment, then he was one of the few regular soldiers not to serve in South Africa, as The Cameronians were in India.

To locate his military record you need either to visit The National Archives at Kew, or use the services of an expert military records researcher.

David

[Rodeo]

Having just read your most recent posts in reply to my queries both in this forum and the Africa forum, I must say, David, you're a star!

Firstly, thanks so much for your efforts in finding 'wee Peter' in the 1881 census. Although I have a copy of that census extract, your message brought home to me how I have overlooked significant clues in my genealogical research.

I knew that Peter's pa (Peter Yule senior) was in the 1st Royal Lanarkshire Militia and stationed at Hamilton Barracks but, being unfamiliar with Scottish regiments, I had absolutely no idea that they were associated with the Scottish Rifles (Cameronians). As I'm a descendant of Covenanters, many other of my forebears similarly served in the Cameronians. It should have been obvious.

I'll certainly follow the link you provided to pursue further research on that regiment. It's interesting that you say the Cameronians served in India and not South Africa because I can recall my father talking about his great uncle who was in India. I'd completely forgotten about that until you mentioned it. Again, it's an oral history clue stupidly overlooked. So, I did, in fact, leap to a wrong conclusion that Peter Yule had served in the Boer War because I failed to find him in the 1891 and 1901 census extracts.

Thanks too, David, for your post re William Paterson, my great uncle, in the Africa forum. How can one procure a copy of the Family History publication you cited?

Needless to say, your help is most appreciated, David.

Cheers,

Rodeo