McDonalds

[Jack]

Hi Andy,
As DavidWW mentioned earlier, it's not certain that the Margaret (Reid) McDONALD
who died as aged 25 at the City Poorhouse is "yours".
But like yourselves, i just can't find another Margaret that might suit.

I could only guess that it is Margaret who died in 1860, and that hubby James had abandoned his family for some reason.
(maybe distraught? losing his daur & wife within two weeks?)
If he did leave, then where did he go? No easy answer to that.
Staying on in Scotland would at least give a chance of finding his DC.
But we just don't know - can't see him in Glasgow 1861 either.

Can't find a DC for wee John born 1850 between 1855-61.
Nor see him in the 1861 Glasgow census; so maybe he did die pre 1855.

As for Alexander McDONALD born 1856 in the 1861 census; the 5yr gr-son is the only suitable i can find.
But this is no proof - your Alexander may be elsewhere, missed out, or whatever....

Did you manage to visit the Clan Donald Centre when you were in Skye? Any luck?
Jack

[Pandabean]

Hi Jack,

Thank you. I myself cannot find another Margaret Reid M*cDonald at all. If there is no other one then she prob died before 1861 but she did have a daughter in 1859 - Janet.

This really is a dificult one to trace. To prove it I would need to find a DC for John or James and see if the ones in the census are linked.

As for the Clan Donald centre, they were very helpful but without any parents names they could not pin point the family. They gave me a possible family which had a James aged 12 in the 1841 census. he has a brother John and their father is Donald McDonald.

[Jack]

Hi Andy,
I've misled you somewhat - this has been hiding in a "wrong" notebook.
There is a John McDONALD born abt 1850 in 1861 - though whether he's "yours" is another thing.
I suppose it's a wee glimmer of hope in that he might be.
Phoned The Mitchell today to see if they had records; but alas, it seems there are none for this school.
--
1861 census 644-1 Ed 123 p 3 (St. Pauls)
Industrial Ragged School, 61 Rottenrow, Glasgow.
John McDONALD, 10, scholar, b Glasgow.
--
Jack

[sheilajim]

Hi Jack

I have been following this thread as I am also tracing McDonalds. Because the name is so common it makes them difficult to trace.

But "Ragged" School! "Rottenrow" What kind of names are these for schools and addresses?

Regards

Sheila

[emanday]

...snipped...
But "Ragged" School! "Rottenrow" What kind of names are these for schools and addresses?
...snipped...

Believe it or not Sheila, I was born in Glasgow Royal Maternity hospital situated in a street called Rottenrow No one ever referred to the hospital by its full name. It was simply a case of "You were born in Rottenrow".

This from Wikipeadia -

The origins of the street's name is subject to debate - some historians claim that it comes from the fact that the area was originally used as a dumping ground for refuse and sewage by the Glaswegians of the period. Others believe that it is derived from the Gaelic phrase Rat-an-righ, which translates as "Road Of The Kings" - presumably in relation to its close proximity to Glasgow Cathedral.

Needless to say, I was always told it was the latter explanation that applied

[Jack]

Hi Sheila and Mary,
I'll reply over on "Research Sources".
Andy's McDonalds are complicated enough for me withoot adding streets!
Jack

[Jack]

Hi Andy,
Well, we've found a James McDONALD with the same parents as your Alexander....
You'll remember a witness at Alexander's 1885 marriage was a James McDonald.
Is it leaning towards Gr-sons James 6 & Alexander 4 in 1861 as being "yours"?
Their birth years & places are certainly very suitable for this James and Alexander.
[meant to mention - you'll notice that on this James' 1879 MC father was a fireman
and as you know, on Alexander's 1885 MC father was a steam ship fireman
James' 1936 DC age 82; informant adopted daur Margaret; father was a seaman
Alexander's 1947 DC age 90; informant son James; father was a ship stoker]
Maybe no proof they're brothers, but might give you something to think about anyway!
--
1879 MC (Bathgate)
James McDONALD (25) joiner, 318 Gallowgate St, Glasgow.
Parents - James MacDONALD (dcd) fireman & Margaret ms REID (dcd).
Married - 2 MAY 1879 at Bathgate.
Joan BROWN (24) domestic servant, 47 Engine St, Bathgate.
Parents - Robert [sic] BROWN, mason & Catherine Faisby? ms LEISHMAN.
--
>1881 Census Place: Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland
>Dwelling: 76 Watson St
>Source: FHL Film 0203664 GRO Ref Volume 644-9 EnumDist 99 Page 17
>James MC DONALD M 26 M Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland Rel: Head Occ: Joiner
>Johanna MC DONALD M 27 F Linlithgow, Linlithgow, Scotland Rel: Wife
--
1891 census 487 Ed 1 p 15 (Polmont)
A. G. Cottages.
James McDONALD, head, marr, 35, ship joiner, b Glasgow, LKS
Joanne McDONALD, wife, marr, 35, ----------b Linlithgow, Linlithgowshire.
--
1901 census 479 Ed 3A p 57 (Falkirk)
Bank Street.
James McDONALD, head, marr, 47, ship joiner, b Glasgow, LKS
Joanna McDONALD, wife, marr, 47, ------------b Linlithgow, Linlithgowshire
Margaret McDONALD, daur, 9, scholar, b England.
George GAFF, visitor, 2yrs, -------------b Dundee, Forfarshire
William H. STEPHENSON, lodger, musician, b Gibraltar, British Subject
[wee George HARDIE or GAFF was b 8 Sep 1898 Dundee - also recorded in Falkirk,
to Mary HARDIE, widow of Willam GAFF, a joiner who died 16 Jan 1897]
--
1915 MC (Row)
James Mitchell PETTIGREW (26), warehouseman, 54 Alexandra Parade, Glasgow.
Parents - William PETTIGREW, wagon builder & Jane Ann ms MITCHELL.
Married - 15 MAY 1915 at Helensburgh.
Margaret S. McDONALD (23), childrens nurse, Thornbridge, Laurieston, Falkirk.
Parents - James McDONALD, joiner & Joan ms BROWN.
--
1926 DC (Falkirk)
Joan McDONALD (73) d 31 DEC 1926 at Thornbridge, Falkirk.
Parents - James [sic] BROWN (dcd), contractor & Catherine ms LEISHMAN (dcd).
Informant - Margaret PETTIGREW, daur.
--
1936 DC (Falkirk)
James McDONALD (82) joiner, d 11 JAN 1936 at Thornbridge, Falkirk.
Parents - James McDONALD (dcd), seaman & Margaret ms REID (dcd).
Informant - Margaret PETTIGREW, adopted daur.
--
1951 DC (Glasgow)
Margaret Shepherd PETTIGREW (59) d 7 JUN 1951 at 209 Bellahouston Dr, Glasgow.
Parents - James McDONALD (dcd), joiner & Joan ms BROWN (dcd).
Informant - Jas. M. PETTIGREW, widower.
--
Jack

[Pandabean]

Never noticed your recent post Jack. Too busy chasing up other lines and busy with work and Uni at the same time.

So from what you are saying it seems more likely that those census records are of my Alexander and James. If so then John must have died before Statuatory Records.

Then if this is truely them then it proves that I am linked to the Isle of Skye. Which is what I was hoping for.

Thanks Jack.

[Pandabean]

Longshot here but I tried to see if James' address in his marriage to Joan was the same as the grandparents. But nope didn't look like it.

[Jack]

Hi again Andy, i'll certainly try and help with your queries.
>Have you any ideas how I can trace my James McDonald and prove his link to Skye?
>All I have is that 1851 Census and the possible sons staying with grandparents later on (61 & 71).
ANS -
At the moment the circumstantial evidence is getting a bit better because you now have a
James and an Alexander with the same parents - ie James McDONALD & Margaret REID.
Also both their MCs say father's occupation was a fireman.
Both have the right age & birthplace to be the James & Alexander in 1861 & 1871 with their GF John McDONALD,
and are the only ones i can see together in Glasgow that fit.
(pity we don't know if the 10yr old John in the Ragged School 1861 is the John born 1850, or that we KNEW he reached adulthood)
Though i suppose you would've expected him also to be with his GF if it is him.

This GF John McDONALD was born Broadford - same place as James McDonald in the 1851 census.
GF John's 1877 DC says he was previously married to Marion McINNES.
So a Scottish DC of a James McDonald (fireman/stoker/seaman), widower of Margaret Reid, with these parents might be useful.
But if he was away at sea, he may have died anywhere....
(i've checked Skye born James McDonald 35 in the 1861 Marine census, but he was a passenger, fisherman, and married)

James McDONALD / Joan BROWN 1879 MC - says his father was deceased.
Alexander McDONALD / Margaret ADAMSON 1885 MC - also says his father was deceased.
So no option at the moment but to believe that he could've died sometime up to 1879.
[presuming meantime that James IS Alexander's brother]
--
Another small hope is that a descendant of your Alexander & Maggie Adams(on) would have family knowledge or "rumour"
that Alexander had a brother James and both were reared by their GF because their parents had died when they were young.
Likewise with James' adopted daur Margaret who married James Pettigrew (i don't yet know if they had any children).
Or even the descendants of John McDonald (born~1852) who could be your Alexander's ½ brother.
But after so many years any family stories could well be forgotten....
--
>One thing I noticed is that Alexander McDonald named his son James and daughter Margaret.
>Would he still do this if he never knew them well?
ANS -
Very possibly - Alexander was well aware who his parents actually were on his 1885 MC to Maggie Adamson.
As was the James who married Joan Brown in 1879 (but a pity the marriage doesn't seem to have produced children).
--
So i suppose the bottom line hasn't changed much - things are still not proven beyond doubt.
But at least you now have a James & Alexander, with same parents, who's ages fit those names in the 1861 & 1871 censuses.
Though no address link-ups on censuses, MCs, or DCs.

Maybe you could just "pencil in" the Skye link till you've got time (a lot) for an in-depth study of the Skye MacDonalds....
But i'm sure much will have already been done on them.
You can at least now go back to the Clan Donald Centre with possible names of ancestors.
We have to hope that John MacDONALD's 1877 DC does have correctly named parents, but no reason to think otherwise.
Donald MacDONALD & Ann McKENZIE, and their son
John McDONALD (b~1800 d.1877) who firstly married Marion McINNES in Skye, then Janet SCOULAR in Glasgow.
Seems all the family were quite clued up on family names as his son John even gave his father's 1st wife's name.
(and she'd died by 1851 before he was even born - about 1852)
--
And post a query on, say, the Rootsweb Inverness or MacDonald Lists to see if anyone else is researching the same family?
Jack
ps, perhaps some of our TS experts (after weighing up the "evidence")
could give their opinions on the possibility that James & Alexander were brothers?
--