Which Andrew Stoddart is the right one?

Mo-anne · Post by **Mo-anne** » Thu Sep 06, 2007 8:44 am

Walter Stoddart was born in Yarrow (26-8-1849) His parents were Andrew Stoddart and Elizabeth Scott – marriage was Jan 1848. However, when I have tried to locate Andrew Stoddart (throughIGI) I have found two likely Andrews .

Andrew (“the elder”)was born on 14.10.1825 : his parents were Walter Stoddart and Janet Eliot whose male children were named Walter (eldest son ), Matthew, Andrew and Henry.

Andrew (“the younger”) was born on 22.2.1830; his parents were James Stoddart and Isabel Richardson who married in 1801. I think their male children were called Thomas and Alexander – in 1815 another James Stoddart married another Isabel Richardson in the same area and I have “allocated” Andrew (born in 1830) and John (born in 1822) to this couple; there is also a James (born in 1819) who I think was born to the first couple ( the birth records refer to mother as “Isabella” for Andrew, John and James).

My assumption at the moment is that Andrew “the elder” is the father of Walter Stoddart (b.1849) due to the recurrence of first names ; Walter's male children were called Walter, James, Andrew and Robert – but is there any way I have find further info to support/invalidate this assumption?

I suspect that a census record might help if one Andrew was married and the other unmarried at the time but the conundrum repeats itself when I try to identify Andrew “the elder”s father as I have so many Walter Stoddarts born in Yarrow at the relevant time scale that I don’t know where to start.

What other possible sources are there to help unravel this ?

Any pointers gratefully received!

claudette · Post by **claudette** » Thu Sep 06, 2007 11:30 am

Hi

According to Ancestry, Andrew Stoddart, married to Elizabeth and father of Walter born in 1849, was born about 1826 in Yarrow. This would mean your Andrew "the elder" is the Andrew you are looking for.

In the 1861 census, Andrew was living in Rae Street, Moffat, Dumfriesshire and was working as a "Bus Condactore" - presumably Bus Conductor. He was married to Elizabeth aged 38 and they had 5 children - Walter aged 11, Elizabeth aged 9, James aged 7, Jessie aged 4 and Andrew aged 1.

In the 1871 census, Andrew was living in Holm Street, Moffat, Dumfriesshire and was working as a "Bus Conducter". He was married to Elizabeth aged 48 and they had 4 children living with them - Elizabeth aged 19, James aged 17, Jessie aged 14 and Andrew aged 11. Walter had moved out and it looks like he was working as a servant at a hotel in Edinburgh.

In the 1881 census, Andrew was living at 4 Altrive Place, Moffat, Dumfriesshire and was working as a Cab Proprietor. He was married to Elizabeth aged 60 and they had the same 4 children living with them as in 1871.

In the 1891 census, Andrew was back living in Holm Street, Moffat, Dumfriesshire and was working as a Carriage Hirer. Elizabeth must have died and he had 2 of his children living with him- Elizabeth aged 39, and Jessie aged 34. There was also Andrew R Stoddart aged 9 living with them - he was Jessie's son and born in Moffat.

There is nothing on Ancestry for him for the 1901 census, so he presumably had died by then.

I would imagine you can find further details on SP, but I haven't looked on there.

Hope this is of help to you.

Kind regards
Claudette

Post by **emanday** » Thu Sep 06, 2007 11:34 am

Hi Mo-Anne,

Did a census search on Ancestry. Here Walter is in 1851, 1861, 1871, 1881, 1891 and 1901

1851 Scotland Census
Name: Andrew Stoddart
Age: 25
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1826
Using the birth year for Andrew (hopefully truthfull) I found this in IGI
ANDREW STODDART
Birth: 14 OCT 1825 Yarrow, Selkirk, Scotland
Parents:
Father: WALTER STODDART
Mother: JANET ELLIOT
Relationship: Head
Spouse's Name: Elizabeth
Gender: Male
Where born: Yarrow, Selkirk
Parish Number: 779
Civil Parish: Yarrow
County: Selkirkshire
Address: Catslacknow
Occupation: Parish Ministers Servt

Household Members: Name Age
Andrew Stoddart 25
Elizabeth Stoddart 33
Walter Stoddart 1

and again...

1861 Scotland Census
Name: Andrew Stoddart
Age: 35
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1826
Relationship: Head
Spouse's name : Elizabeth
Gender: Male
Where born: Yarrow, Selkirk
Registration Number: 842
Registration district: Moffat
Civil Parish: Moffat
County: Dumfriesshire
Address: Rae St
Occupation: Bus Condactore

Household Members: Name Age
Andrew Stoddart 35
Andrew Stoddart 1
Elizabeth Stoddart 38
Elizabeth Stoddart 9
James Stoddart 7
Jessie Stoddart 4
Walter Stoddart 11

Walter is out of the house now (I've left out the list of other people - probably other staff)...

1871 Scotland Census
Name: Walter Stoddart
Age: 21
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1850
Relationship: Servant
Gender: Male
Where born: Yurrow, Selkirkshire
Registration Number: 685/2
Registration district: St Andrew
Civil Parish: Edinburgh St Andrew
County: Midlothian
Address: 46 West Register St P Of Waloo Hotel
Occupation: Boots

Now he has a wife...

1881 Scotland Census
Name: Walter Stoddart
Age: 31
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1850
Relationship: Head
Spouse's name : Sarah
Gender: Male
Where born: Yarrowfews, Selkirkshire
Registration Number: 572/2
Registration district: Barrhead
Civil Parish: Abbey
County: Renfrewshire
Address: Mc Brayne'S Land
Occupation: Butler - Domestic Serv.

Household Members: Name Age
Andrew Stoddart 5
Catherine Stoddart 7
Sarah Stoddart 28
Walter Stoddart 31
Walter Stoddart 4 Mon

Him and his family again...

1891 Scotland Census
Name: Walter Stoddart
Age: 41
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1850
Relationship: Head
Gender: Male
Where born: Yarrow F, Selkirkshire
Registration Number: 644/9
Registration district: Kelvin
Civil Parish: Glasgow Barony
County: Lanarkshire
Address: 9a Scotia St
Occupation: Butler Domestic Servant

Household Members: Name Age
John Octter 24
Catherine Stoddart 17
Isabella Stoddart 7
Walter Stoddart 41
Walter Stoddart 10

His age is a bit out here, but seems to be him...
Maybe the Burnetts are relatives?

1901 Scotland Census
Name: Walter Stoddart
Age: 56
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1845
Relationship: Head
Spouse's name : Sarah
Gender: Male
Where born: Yarrow, Selkirkshire
Registration Number: 644/7
Registration district: Blythswood
Civil Parish: Glasgow Barony
County: Lanarkshire
Address: 29 Bucclench St
Occupation: Domestic Rutler

Household Members: Name Age
Alexander Burnett 30
Catherine Burnett 17
Walter Burnett 8 months
Isabella Stoddart 17
James Stoddart 70
Jessie Stoddart 8
Richard Stoddart 17
Robert Stoddart 65
Sarah Stoddart 47
Walter Stoddart 56
Alexander Wood 18

Mo-anne · Post by **Mo-anne** » Thu Sep 06, 2007 11:39 am

A million thanks for your help and this weath of information!

Does anyone have any pointers on how to tackle this problem when there are no censuses to help as this is a recurrent problem for me trying to sort out the Stoddarts all of whom were born in Yarrow.

Many thanks

Mo-Anne

claudette · Post by **claudette** » Thu Sep 06, 2007 11:41 am

Hi again

Just to clarify how I was able to determine which Andrew was your man - it came from the 1851 census on Ancestry, where it shows Andrew (born around 1826 in Yarrow) living with his wife Elizabeth and their 1 year old son Walter.

I haven't gone any further back than that. I would imagine that if you can find a death certificate for Andrew then that should give the information you need on his parents.

Happy hunting!

Best wishes
Claudette

Mo-anne · Post by **Mo-anne** » Thu Sep 06, 2007 5:11 pm

Many, many thanks again for all this - I need to sit down and absorb the info but it adds up with what I know - Walter was in domestic service at the time of his marriage to Sarah in 1873 in Edinburgh. and had risen to being a butler by 1890. The names of the children also fit with what I've gleaned from family members so all this looks like being the right family.

But life's never simple - I can't find James Stoddart ( born to Walter and Sarah on 3 June 1890) on either the 1891 or the 1901 census. Sarah is also missing from the household in 1891 so she was presumably with James somewhere (at her mum's??) but the only one missing in 1901 is James...

Regards Mo-anne

claudette · Post by **claudette** » Thu Sep 06, 2007 11:31 pm

Hi yet again

On Ancestry I found Sarah Stoddart in the 1891 census staying with her parents, Richard and Catherine Wood at Monktonhall Toll, in Inveresk, Midlothian. Her son James, aged 10 months was there and there's also a Richard T W Stoddart staying there as well.

I haven't found Sarah or James so far on the 1901 census. Do you know when she died or could she have re-married?

Does this raise more questions than provide answers?!

Best wishes
Claudette

Mo-anne · Post by **Mo-anne** » Fri Sep 07, 2007 9:04 am

Fascinating stuff this - a bit like a a real-life detective story !
Sarah's father was in service, as was her husband and I knew Richard was working at Monkton Hall. I knew James was a baby in 1891 and suspected Sarah may have been at her mother's if not with her husband after the birth.
As far as I know, Sarah died sometime after the death of one of her sons in World War One but I know of no remarriage. I have no idea who Richard T W Stoddart was - but every generation of Stoddarts seemed to average about eight per family so it's doubtless some relative whom I will hopefully identify in time.
I know that James was definitely alive somwhere in 1901 as he is the one that started me off on all this - he was my grandfather and died in 1970

Thanks again for your active interest !
Regards Mo-anne

Mo-anne · Post by **Mo-anne** » Tue Sep 11, 2007 5:20 pm

Mystery of whereabouts of Sarah and James solved from a copy of the 1901 census return from SP.
It clearly shows the whole of Walter's family as present under his roof on census night including the 10 year old James (masquerading as a 70 year old on the ancestor.co info that Claudette kindly found), Robert (aged 6 and not 65) and Catherine Burnett, the eldest married daughter (aged 27 and not 17).
Walter's age is also accurate on the SP image.

Thanks to all you helped unravel this one

Regards Mo-anne

claudette · Post by **claudette** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 9:30 am

Hi Mo-Anne

So pleased you've been able to unravel the mysteries of James Stoddart and his parents Walter and Sarah.

I mustn't take the credit for providing the final piece of the jigsaw in the shape of the 1901 census as Mary gave you that.

I double checked the 1891 census for you on Ancestry - Richard T W Stoddart is James's elder brother and of course appears on the 1901 census. Have you found the info for the 1891 census for Sarah and James on SP now you know where they were or do you want me to send you all the info from Ancestry?

Best wishes
Claudette