Inverness - place name

trish1 · Post by **trish1** » Thu Jan 08, 2009 12:42 pm

I have a place listed on a certificate as Granton, Inverness. I have found Granton-on-Spey and Grantown-on-Spey as possibilities. Are there any other places that would fit?

Are these the same place?
What would be the parish for OPRs as I don't seem able to find either as a parish

thanks

Trish

LesleyB · Post by **LesleyB** » Thu Jan 08, 2009 1:27 pm

Hi Trish
Can I ask when the date is? Is it an OPR entry or a post 1855 cert?
Do you have the SP reference number to hand? That should help place it, if it is not Grantown -on-Spey. which I'm sure is the same as Grantown and Granton-on-Spey. We used to stop there every year when I was a child for a teas & biscuits, on the way to our holiday destination further north! So for me it is a place synonmous with tea-rooms and a feeling of being "nearly there"...

Best wishes
Lesley

trish1 · Post by **trish1** » Fri Jan 09, 2009 12:59 am

It's on an Australian death certificate Lesley. It was provided by informant (child) as the place of birth of his father who has died.

I had thought this was probably the person I was looking for (from the IGI)
DONALD JOHNSON Birth: 21 APR 1826 Christening: 26 MAY 1826 Croy And Dalcross, Inverness Father: DONALD JOHNSON Mother: JANET MCKENZIE

On what I believe is his immigration, he says he comes from Croy, Nairn (query on Nairn/Inverness, expertly answered for me by Andrew). He immigrated with a brother William, which also fits as there is a William born to the above Donald and Janet in 1828. (William is much harder to trace as there are many possible William Johnstons in Australia at that time - very few Donald's)

However, his death certificate says he was born in Granton and his mother was Janet Cameron. His age & father fit with the above IGI entry. As his children were all born in Australia & probably never visited Scotland, I still think I may have the correct baptism, but am looking for further proof - perhaps the question is - is Granton near Croy?

Almost forgot - I also found the burial details last night & the inscription says he is from Inverness - so I am in the right part of Scotland, about which I so far know what Andrew has told me!! He is also buried in the "Presbyterian section" which in Australia usually meant they belonged to the Church of Scotland & the above baptism is certainly the best fit I have found.

He married in Oz at the very beginning of civil registration & unfortunately these early NSW marriage records do not usually contain the parent details, but I may have to use that path & attempt to find the actual church marriage record which may have the parent names - it is starting to get expensive! so I look for alternatives.

Trish

LesleyB · Post by **LesleyB** » Fri Jan 09, 2009 11:02 am

Hi Trish
From the town of Grantown-on-Spey to the village of Croy is about 30 miles/50 kilometres. Croy is North West of Grantown.
If you go to Google maps and put in Grantown-on-Spey (the map quality of that part of the world is not too great...) then zoom out just enough so that you can see the Cromarty Firth in the North, follow a line north west from Grantown, and you will be able to see the village Croy not too far inland from the coast. (map quality much better there!)

Best wishes
Lesley

WilmaM · Post by **WilmaM** » Fri Jan 09, 2009 11:41 am

Trish, I don't know if this helps or not
Freecen have a similar family:
1841
Piece: SCT1841/94 Place: Croy & Dalcross -Inverness-shire Enumeration District: 4
Civil Parish: Croy And Dalcross Ecclesiastical Parish, Village or Island: -
Folio: 4 Page: 2
Address: Crocknafad
Surname First name(s) Sex Age Occupation Where Born Remarks
FRASER Duncan M 28 Agricultural Labourer Inverness-shire
FRASER Catharine F 25 Inverness-shire
JOHNSTON Janet F 17 Inverness-shire
JOHNSTON Donald M 15 Outside Census County (1841)
JOHNSTON William M 13 Outside Census County (1841)
JOHNSTON Christy F 9 Outside Census County (1841)

and the Previous household is:
Piece: SCT1841/94 Place: Croy & Dalcross -Inverness-shire Enumeration District: 4
Civil Parish: Croy And Dalcross Ecclesiastical Parish, Village or Island: -
Folio: 4 Page: 2
Address: Lower Muckovy
Surname First name(s) Sex Age Occupation Where Born Remarks
JOHNSTON Donald M 50 Agricultural Labourer Outside Census County (1841)
JOHNSTON Janet F 40 Inverness-shire
CAMERON Mary F 80 Inverness-shire

but confusingly

there is also this family:
1841
Piece: SCT1841/95 Place: Daviot & Dunlichity -Inverness-shire Enumeration District: 5
Civil Parish: Daviot & Dunlichity Ecclesiastical Parish, Village or Island: -
Folio: 5 Page: 14
Address: Moor Of Culloden
Surname First name(s) Sex Age Occupation Where Born Remarks
JOHNSTON Donald M 50 Agricultural Labourer Outside Census County (1841)
JOHNSTON Janet F 40 Inverness-shire
JOHNSTON Janet F 17 Outside Census County (1841)
JOHNSTON Donald M 15 Outside Census County (1841)
JOHNSTON William M 13 Outside Census County (1841)
JOHNSTON Christian F 9 Inverness-shire

In 1851 family 2 are still in the same place:
Culloden Moor
JOHNSTON Donald Head M M 65 Crofter Ross and Cromarty - Redcastle
JOHNSTON Janet Wife M F 58 Crofter's Wife Inverness-shire - Petty
JOHNSTON Christine Dau U F 18 A Scholar Inverness-shire - Croy

No sign of young Donald, but a William could be here:
1851
Piece: SCT1851/128 Place: Cromdale -Morayshire Enumeration District: 6
Civil Parish: Cromdale Ecclesiastical Parish, Village or Island: Cromdale
Folio: 71 Page: 1 Schedule: 2
Address: Maine Of Dellifure
Surname First name(s) Rel Status Sex Age Occupation Where Born Remarks
HENDERSON Janet Head M F 27 Ag Lab Inverness-shire - Croy
HENDERSON Janet Dau - F 3 Inverness-shire - Cromdale
HENDERSON Isabella Dau - F 2 Inverness-shire - Cromdale
HENDERSON Mary Dau - F 3m Inverness-shire - Cromdale
JOHNSTONE William Brothr - M 23 Ag Lab Inverness-shire - Cromdale

as according to the IGI a Janet Johnston married William Henderson:
24 JUL 1846 Cromdale And Inverallan And Advie, Inverness, Scotland &
22 JUL 1846 Daviot And Dunlichity, Inverness, Scotland

When did the brothers leave for Aus? would that fit in?

trish1 · Post by **trish1** » Sat Jan 10, 2009 2:17 am

Many thanks for the replies

Lesley - it does seem quite a distance between the two locations, but I can find nothing else that fits the name Granton.

Wilma

Many thanks for the Census checking, I suddenly remembered FreeCen this am when I was having no joy with a.....y and the weird transcriptions & I found much what you have found. In 1851 there is a Donald of the right age (25), working as a farm labourer - he says born Daviot Inverness - I am about to learn lots more Inverness place names it would seem. I hadn't checked the marriage for sister Janet, but that seems to fit nicely.

I am confused with the two families on 1841 - Are they 2 families? Everything is the same except Christy = Christine and her birthplace! but there could be confusion between Nairn/Inverness. It is about 7 miles between Daviot and Croy.

Should I post the details on the census board to see if anyone else has any ideas as to whether this is one family? I only have the one set of oprs on IGI and SP

This family fits very closely the one on the IGI with the children all baptised at Croy - the only difference seems to be Christian/Christine/Christy who should be called Margaret

or else is missing an opr.

The marriage of Donald Snr to Janet McKenzie is listed as Killearnan R&C which after searching I discover is the parish containing Redcastle.

The dates fit with the immigration - 1855 I have found, c. 1852 as per the death certificate (Aust death certs give length of time in each state) so everything almost fits except the death certificate says Donald's mother was Janet Cameron when I think it must be Janet McKenzie. The Mary Cameron on the 1841 census has me a little bothered also.

I think I will download a couple of Census images & perhaps an OPR birth in case there are clues. Looking for possible births for Donald Snr and Janet I can't find any useful naming pattern options. In Australia Donald named his first son Donald, and 2nd daughter Janet - so that certainly fits.

I may have to also try the Australian marriage (one marriage transcript in Oz costs the same as 30 credits at SP!!) to at least get the church of the marriage. I can almost guarantee it would be the Scots Church in Sydney, but I could be wrong - and I can't yet find where the archives exist for same (the Church has long gone) if at all.

many thanks again

Trish

WilmaM · Post by **WilmaM** » Sat Jan 10, 2009 12:08 pm

I think they must be the same family, as I couldn't find another lot anywhere else.
Perhaps they 'flitted' during the census taking and were picked up twice - would that be possible?

I would post it seperately though and see what other brains can come up with.

The Cameron name picked up twice looks like more than a co-incidence too.

I haven't tried to work out the areas the various census returns show that may help or further confuse

WilmaM · Post by **WilmaM** » Sat Jan 10, 2009 4:00 pm

The 'Maine Of Dellifure ' seems to be near Grantown!
http://www.forestry.gov.uk/pdf/Paperfro ... tTrust.pdf

woodland burial sites in Scotland, including one at Dellifure, near Grantown

Put Dellifure into google map to pinpoint it.

The Moor of Culloden place I can't pinpoint on a map, but the farms either side of it in the census [Balvraid and Nairnside Mains] appear on :
sheet 84 of http://www.nls.uk/maps/os/oneinch_1st_list.html
left hand side center , zoom in until you see Nairnside House, nearby is Mains [presumably Nairnside Mains] and Balvraid.

If you then look to the west of Balvraid you will find Lower Muckovy, can't see Crocknafad but Bogbain is there [that the next household in 1841] .

I can't find a map showing where the Parish Boundaries are [HELP AndrewP] so whether they were in Croy & Dalcross or Daviot & Dunlichity is uncertain, but they seem to meet around that area.

trish1 · Post by **trish1** » Sun Jan 11, 2009 1:52 am

It takes me a long time to come to terms with the Scottish names/descriptions - they sound so romantic in comparison to my location - but I am then unsure if they are parishes, villages, properties (farms) castles etc - so many thanks for the assistance.

I am wondering(probably hoping) if the Cameron is the maiden name of Janet's mother - couple of reasons to convince myself - I always thought my grandmother's maiden name was Boyd - based on family chat - turns out it was my great grandmother's maiden name. I often see women retaining their maiden names on the Scotland census records.

I have found on IGI - Janet Mckenzie baptised 21 April 1795 at Petty, Inverness father Andrew Mckenzie (no mother given)

Marriage 05 MAR 1795 Urquhart And Logie Wester, Ross And Cromarty of Andrew Mckenzie and Nelly Cameron. I don't think Mary/Nelly are changeable names - but could well be an enumerator transcription error - I downloaded the image - is definitely Mary on the image.

There is also a birth for Helen(Ellen?/Nelly) Cameron in Petty, Inverness 1765

Clutching at straws or logical analysis?

Trish

I will post the two census records with a link to this thread - many thanks again for all your help

Post by **AndrewP** » Sun Jan 11, 2009 2:47 am

WilmaM wrote:The 'Maine Of Dellifure ' seems to be near Grantown!
http://www.forestry.gov.uk/pdf/Paperfro ... tTrust.pdf
woodland burial sites in Scotland, including one at Dellifure, near Grantown
Put Dellifure into google map to pinpoint it.

The Moor of Culloden place I can't pinpoint on a map, but the farms either side of it in the census [Balvraid and Nairnside Mains] appear on :
sheet 84 of http://www.nls.uk/maps/os/oneinch_1st_list.html
left hand side center , zoom in until you see Nairnside House, nearby is Mains [presumably Nairnside Mains] and Balvraid.

If you then look to the west of Balvraid you will find Lower Muckovy, can't see Crocknafad but Bogbain is there [that the next household in 1841] .

I can't find a map showing where the Parish Boundaries are [HELP AndrewP] so whether they were in Croy & Dalcross or Daviot & Dunlichity is uncertain, but they seem to meet around that area.

Hi Wilma,

Bogbain, Balvraid and Lower Muckovie were in the detached part of Croy and Dalcross Parish. They were all transferred into Inverness Parish in May 1891. So it depends which series of OS maps you consult as to which parish you find them in.

These places show on a modern OS map at click here. If you are driving northwards up the A9, these places are all on the right when you are on the long downhill approaching Inverness.

Moor of Cullodden (crofts) was in Croy and Dalcross Parish, close to the county boundary. It transferred from Nairnshire to Inverness-shire when that boundary was re-aligned in 1891.

The area can be seen on a modern OS map at click here. I cannot pinpoint which buildings were Moor of Culloden crofts on old or modern maps (if they are still there at all). The list of places transferred across the county boundary appear to follow a sequence on the map, so may be somewhere between Faebuie and Leanach, but certainly somewhere in the area of the Battle of Culloden Visitor Centre (modern).

All the best,

AndrewP