Royal Fusiliers 1914/18

[Lorna Allison]

Hi

Anyone know the best way to search for birth detail for a soldier who is listed as dead but has "Age Unknown" on medal card entry according to the National Archives? He was John C Watkins in the Royal Fusiliers, No GS/32685 died 25/8/1918. I am trying to eliminate the wrong JC Watkins' from a list of 7 who died and can only go by their age.

Grateful for any advice. I am presently waiting to be accepted onto the Great War Forum.

Regards

Lorna

[Currie]

Hello Lorna,

According to the Commonwealth War Graves Commission the soldier is John Charles Watkins. They don’t have an age for him. It just says ‘unknown’ in the search results list and that’s not unusual. http://www.cwgc.org/search/casualty_det ... ty=1749993

There appears to be a John Charles Watkins in Ancestry’s British Army WW1 Service Records but I can’t see the details as I don’t subscribe. (The service number may not match?)

All the best,
Alan

[Lorna Allison]

Hi Alan

Thanks for looking for me. It was from that site that I got the "unknown" age and, yes, there are 6 other JCW's there. I was googling the Royal Fusiliers to see if there might be an archive held somewhere of those joining up giving more personal details ie dob and marriage. I daresay I will be unlucky and mine will have been lost in the London fire.

However, I notice that there are a several different "Royal Fusiliers" and as my John Charles Watkins was Welsh he might have started off in the Royal Welch (Welsh) Fusiliers and after a time might have come to be in the Royal Fusiliers. I can just hear the teeth grinding from those out there who know about the military and probably I am talking utter rubbish In my defence, I came across this happening with a Scottish relative in the Camerons.

I am probably going to join Ancestry at some point Alan but at the moment I am trying to be constructive in deleting the wrong JCW's through the free sites.

Thanks again

Lorna

[Currie]

Hello Lorna,

This would be the young fellow from Pontypool mentioned in your other post. viewtopic.php?f=18&t=15505 If he died during the war, and if both families had a long term connection to Pontypool, there must be a bit of a chance that his name would appear on the local War Memorial. Unfortunately I can’t see anything online for Pontypool.

Here’s the Pontypool War Memorial gates with what looks like lists of soldiers on either side http://maps.google.com/maps?t=h&hl=en&i ... 7,,0,19.92 I’m not sure how you would get to see those, maybe the local library has a list? http://www.torfaen.gov.uk/LeisureAndCul ... brary.aspx

I don’t know about the likelihood of being in a particular regiment. In my limited experience there seem to be all sorts of people from all sorts of places cropping up in all sorts of regiments.

I was just looking at the FreeBMD site. In the 1884 year of his birth, of all the John C* Whatever’s born that year in the whole of England and Wales about 60% had the middle name of Charles.

Hope that helps,
Alan

[Montrose Budie]

Hi Lorna

As you've discovered there were quite a few regiments with "Fusilier" in their title, because fusilier was originally the name of a soldier armed with a light flintlock musket called the fusil. The word was first used around 1680, and later developed into a regimental designation.

The subject of names of regiments is a minefield (pun intended!). Names varied greatly over the years for a number of reasons. Usage wasn't always consistent amongst soldiers or the general public.

For instance, someone in Ayrshire might well refer to having joined 'the fusiliers', when the local regiment concerned was correctly called the Royal Scots Fusiliers, 21st of Foot.

The CWGC website uses the correct regimental names, so that the CWGC J C Watkins above was serving with The Royal Fusiliers, aka The City of London Regiment, 7th of Foot.

10th (Service) Battalion of the The Royal Fusiliers was formed in the City of London in August 1914 as part of K2 [Kitchener's 2nd New Army], although it was a locally raised Battalion, not under the control of the War Office - and had the unofficial title of the Stockbrokers. In September 1914 it was attached to 54th Brigade, 18th (Eastern) Division; October 1914, left Brigade and became Army Troops in same Division; March 1915, transferred to 111th Brigade, 37th Division. Landed at Boulogne 30 July 1915.

Especially later on in WWI it quite possible that a soldier who'd never been near London in his life could be drafted into the 10th Bn, The Royal Fusiliers. This could happen when he was conscripted with no choice of regiment; when his original battalion sustained massive losses with the survivors being distributed amongst other regiments, normally in the same brigade or division; or when he'd been hospitalised from illness or wounds, and, when discharged from hospital and fit for service, ended up with a new regiment as the original regiment were far way or no longer existed.

If this soldier had served earlier with other regiments this will sometimes, but not always, be shown on the medal card.

IN WWI other 'fusilier' regiments that I can quickly find were, -

Royal Northumberland Fusiliers (5th of Foot)
Lancashire Fusiliers (20th of Foot)
Royal Scots Fusiliers (21st of Foot)
Royal Welch Fusiliers (23rd of Foot)
The Royal Inniskilling Fusiliers (27th of Foot)
Princess Victoria's Royal Irish Fusiliers (87th and 89th of Foot)

mb

[Lorna Allison]

Thanks for that mb

I have tried to contact Pontypool Library by phone but, as posted on net, they are closed for two weeks while renovations are being done - and when they close they REALLY close, not even a robotic answer on the phone! I'll wait 'til they reopen as I find libraries generally pretty user friendly places and they might have some useful info to pass on.

Thanks for your help.

Am presently in discussion with him who holds the other purse string on a plan to send for two certs a month. Confidently expecting full cooperation

Bye for now

Lorna