Hi
I have any number of odd characters to sort out in the family tree. In November 1864 a Christopher Henderson is born to Christopher Henderson and Janet Fraser Aitken at Whitebank Dairy, Dumbarton Road Glasgow.
The person who registered the birth was an Isabella Sharp and she said she was a cousin but did not mention which side of the family. Going on the basis that there are Irish connections, would anyone be willing to help me try to find where Isabella Sharp was living in 1861? I believe that she may be in the 1851 census in the Vennel, Greenock, but would not like to confirm that one off the top of my head!
Why young Christopher was born at the dairy I have no idea...! Does anyone have any good ideas of how I can find out who was living there at the time?
Deborah
Registration of birth.....
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Alienore
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CatrionaL
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Hullo Deborah
Glad to have you with us on Talking Scot.
Home deliveries (births) were the norm at the time of Christopher's birth. I would therefore imagine that he was born at the dairy because it was the family home and probably also place of work. Have you tried finding the Hendersons on the 1861 and 1871 census? One or other may give the Dairy address for the family.
Someone may be able to look up the Glasgow directory for the year 1864 for you.
Best wishes
Catriona
Glad to have you with us on Talking Scot.
Home deliveries (births) were the norm at the time of Christopher's birth. I would therefore imagine that he was born at the dairy because it was the family home and probably also place of work. Have you tried finding the Hendersons on the 1861 and 1871 census? One or other may give the Dairy address for the family.
Someone may be able to look up the Glasgow directory for the year 1864 for you.
Best wishes
Catriona
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Alienore
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Christopher Henderson
Hi Catriona
Christopher's parents were only married in 1863 and his father was a potter by profession so I'm not clear as to why they'd be at a dairy. In 1861 Christopher senior is a potter and living in the heart of Anderston in Glasgow. His usual place of residence - and that of his wife - were again right in the heart of the city at the time of their marriage.
His future wife was living with her parents in 1861 and there was no obvious connection with the dairy that crops up in 1864.
I have no idea if there's a family connection with the dairy or not and I don't know if there's an easy method of finding out who's living at the dairy in 1861 without going through the whole of the census for that part of Glasgow.
That's why I posted Christopher here in the hopes that someone might be able to suggest a possible solution to my puzzlement about him. It may be that his mother wanted her firstborn to be born in healthier surroundings than the tenements in the city centre would have provided or it may be that they were living and working there but if that were the case why did the cousin register the birth and not either of the parents?
Deborah, hoping she hasn't confused people further!
Christopher's parents were only married in 1863 and his father was a potter by profession so I'm not clear as to why they'd be at a dairy. In 1861 Christopher senior is a potter and living in the heart of Anderston in Glasgow. His usual place of residence - and that of his wife - were again right in the heart of the city at the time of their marriage.
His future wife was living with her parents in 1861 and there was no obvious connection with the dairy that crops up in 1864.
I have no idea if there's a family connection with the dairy or not and I don't know if there's an easy method of finding out who's living at the dairy in 1861 without going through the whole of the census for that part of Glasgow.
That's why I posted Christopher here in the hopes that someone might be able to suggest a possible solution to my puzzlement about him. It may be that his mother wanted her firstborn to be born in healthier surroundings than the tenements in the city centre would have provided or it may be that they were living and working there but if that were the case why did the cousin register the birth and not either of the parents?
Deborah, hoping she hasn't confused people further!
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Russell
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Hi Deborah
If you look at the present map of Glasgow you'll see that Dumbarton Road is not actually too far from Anderston. It's a straight road out toward the town of Dumbarton.
Glasgow was beginning to extend out in that direction around that time and would soon have shipyards and works all along the Clyde.
I wondered if it was the cousin who was the connection with the dairy.
Dairies were not always out in the country. There was quite a big commercial dairy right in the most built up part of Glasgow (Next to the Barras) right into the 1960's. It had tenements in front of it and was accessed through a pend in the buildings.
I wonder if the Mitchell has trade directories for that time ? They list commercial premises (provided the owner would pay the few pennies to be included).
I tried old-maps.co.uk but the site was down for essential maintenance.
Russell
If you look at the present map of Glasgow you'll see that Dumbarton Road is not actually too far from Anderston. It's a straight road out toward the town of Dumbarton.
Glasgow was beginning to extend out in that direction around that time and would soon have shipyards and works all along the Clyde.
I wondered if it was the cousin who was the connection with the dairy.
Dairies were not always out in the country. There was quite a big commercial dairy right in the most built up part of Glasgow (Next to the Barras) right into the 1960's. It had tenements in front of it and was accessed through a pend in the buildings.
I wonder if the Mitchell has trade directories for that time ? They list commercial premises (provided the owner would pay the few pennies to be included).
I tried old-maps.co.uk but the site was down for essential maintenance.
Russell
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StewL
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Deborah
Just a thought and a stab in the dark.
Is it possible that she was just visiting the dairy with her cousin to get the milk and whoops the bairns on its way. and no ambulance to cart her off to the nearest maternity hospital or midwife.
Just a thought and a stab in the dark.
Is it possible that she was just visiting the dairy with her cousin to get the milk and whoops the bairns on its way. and no ambulance to cart her off to the nearest maternity hospital or midwife.
Stewie
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Searching for: Anderson, Balks, Barton, Courtney, Davidson, Downie, Dunlop, Edward, Flucker, Galloway, Graham, Guthrie, Higgins, Laurie, Mathieson, McLean, McLuckie, Miln, Nielson, Payne, Phillips, Porterfield, Stewart, Watson
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AndrewP
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Hi Deborah,
I will put forward another theory about the birth at the dairy.
Was this her first child? If so, from my research, I see a lot of first births took place at the house of the new grandmother. There may have been no midwife available (did they cost, and therefore not available if you could not afford her). So the new grandmother stood in for midwife, helping her daughter using her own experience in such matters.
So I am saying that the new grandmother may have been the resident at the Dairy.
Does that sound plausible?
All the best,
AndrewP
I will put forward another theory about the birth at the dairy.
Was this her first child? If so, from my research, I see a lot of first births took place at the house of the new grandmother. There may have been no midwife available (did they cost, and therefore not available if you could not afford her). So the new grandmother stood in for midwife, helping her daughter using her own experience in such matters.
So I am saying that the new grandmother may have been the resident at the Dairy.
Does that sound plausible?
All the best,
AndrewP
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Alienore
- Posts: 24
- Joined: Mon Aug 28, 2006 3:47 pm
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
Registration of birth
My goodness, what a lot of information you have all given me!
Christopher's paternal grandmother was dead by the time of the marriage of his parents and his maternal grandmother lived in North Street in 1861 so the connection isn't a grandmother. It may be that the Sharps lived there themselves but if so I will have fun looking through the census for 1861 and trade directories to see if they were there then.
The cousin being a midwife could be useful data too and I'll bear that in mind, although I like the idea of Janet going to get some milk and ooops! the baby is on the way! Somehow that story has not made its way down the generations..... lol!
Thanks to all of you who have replied.
Much appreciated
Deborah
Christopher's paternal grandmother was dead by the time of the marriage of his parents and his maternal grandmother lived in North Street in 1861 so the connection isn't a grandmother. It may be that the Sharps lived there themselves but if so I will have fun looking through the census for 1861 and trade directories to see if they were there then.
The cousin being a midwife could be useful data too and I'll bear that in mind, although I like the idea of Janet going to get some milk and ooops! the baby is on the way! Somehow that story has not made its way down the generations..... lol!
Thanks to all of you who have replied.
Much appreciated
Deborah
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isobelc
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Isabella Sharp
Hi Deborah,
I think your Isabella Sharp may be the 23 year old wife of John Sharp, Pastry Baker, living at 36 Brown Street, Clyde, Glasgow in 1861. They have a 4 month old baby son called William who would seem likely to be the William Atkin Sharp born 6th December 1860 in Clyde to John Sharp and Isabella Aitken. John and Isabella married in Blytheswood district in 1859. At that time Isabella was living at 115 Renfield Street and her parents are given as Robert Aitken (Weaver) and Euphemia Aitken m/s Gemmell (deceased). She was (I think) a Bootbinder. The 1861 census indicates that Isabella was born in Springburn.
Regards,
Isobel
I think your Isabella Sharp may be the 23 year old wife of John Sharp, Pastry Baker, living at 36 Brown Street, Clyde, Glasgow in 1861. They have a 4 month old baby son called William who would seem likely to be the William Atkin Sharp born 6th December 1860 in Clyde to John Sharp and Isabella Aitken. John and Isabella married in Blytheswood district in 1859. At that time Isabella was living at 115 Renfield Street and her parents are given as Robert Aitken (Weaver) and Euphemia Aitken m/s Gemmell (deceased). She was (I think) a Bootbinder. The 1861 census indicates that Isabella was born in Springburn.
Regards,
Isobel
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Alienore
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- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
Registration of birth
Hi Isobel
I will bear that Isabella Sharp in mind and see if there's anything that links her to either Janet or Christopher's families. You may well have found the missing link! Thank you very much for your help.
Will check the next time I'm at Register House.
Deborah
I will bear that Isabella Sharp in mind and see if there's anything that links her to either Janet or Christopher's families. You may well have found the missing link! Thank you very much for your help.
Will check the next time I'm at Register House.
Deborah