JOHN McCREADIE DIED 2 AUGUST 1879, BURIED WHERE?

q98 · Post by **q98** » Fri Apr 20, 2007 11:53 am

At 9PM, 2nd August 1879, John McCREADIE (occupation Stoker) was killed on board No. 1 tug boat of Ayr Harbour. His Death Certificate states “crushed to death under the lever of an engine”. The family domicile was recorded as “8 Allison Street, Newton (sic) Ayr”. The 4th August 1879 edition of “The Scotsman” newspaper reported his death but identified him as “John Mackenzie”, an error corrected in the following day’s edition. John's father, also John McCREADIE (occupation Fisherman), was alive at the time of his son's demise and living in Ballantrae.

Although not related, I am researching the remaining family members;
Margaret (NELSON) McCREADIE whom John married on 9th June 1871 at The Manse, Newton-on-Ayr, Jane (b. 28 October 1873, Newton-on-Ayr), Isabella (b. 5 May 1876, Newton-on-Ayr) and John (b. 3 July 1879, Newton-on-Ayr) - ONE MONTH BEFORE HIS FATHER'S DEATH. They emigrated to Australia c. 1881-1883 and I have located Jane's grave in Innisfail, far north Queensland and John Jnr served with 15th Battalion, Australian Imperial Force, falling 10 July 1917.

I have been unable to locate the final resting place of John McCREADIE (Stoker) in either Ayr or Ballantrae, having checked with both local Libraries & Cemetries. Any assistance would be greatly appreciated.

Kind regards and thanks in advance from Australia

Post by **emanday** » Fri Apr 20, 2007 12:19 pm

Is there any possibility he might have been buried at sea?

q98 · Post by **q98** » Fri Apr 20, 2007 12:28 pm

Very much doubt he was buried at sea. "The Scotsman" reported:
QUOTE
On Saturday night, while the Ayr tug was returning to Ayr Harbour after taking a vessel to sea ..."
UNQUOTE

As his Death Extract details "Medical Attendant" as "John Riddell, Surgeon", it is probable the corpse was landed and examined by Dr Riddell.

Post by **emanday** » Fri Apr 20, 2007 12:36 pm

Sorry, I didn't mean right away!

Many seamen, even if they died in their own beds, choose to be buried at sea.

DavidWW · Post by **DavidWW** » Fri Apr 20, 2007 12:37 pm

Very much agreed with Jim.

A tug boat based in Ayr would be most unlikely to be operating more than a few miles away from Ayr harbour in the Firth of Clyde, so that a burial at sea I could not believe>

David
from Ayr !!

DavidWW · Post by **DavidWW** » Fri Apr 20, 2007 12:38 pm

emanday wrote:Sorry, I didn't mean right away!

Many seamen, even if they died in their own beds, choose to be buried at sea.

Unlikely to be permitted !!

David

Post by **emanday** » Fri Apr 20, 2007 12:50 pm

I attended one in 1977 and they are still an option.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/4173400.stm

DavidWW · Post by **DavidWW** » Fri Apr 20, 2007 1:23 pm

emanday wrote:I attended one in 1977 and they are still an option.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/4173400.stm

In England, the situation is as follows, .....

There are only two places where sea burials are permitted: Newhaven and the Needles Spoil Ground, to the West of the Isle of Wight.

When you register the death, you should tell the registrar that you are planning a sea burial and obtain a Coroner’s Out of England Form.

The free licence must be obtained from the Marine Environmental Protection agency at the Ministry of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (Tel: 0207-238-5872 or 0207-238-5868)

As far as I can determine the situation in Scotland is similar, with the only area permitted being a small area in the Firth of Forth. As above various permissions/licences are required. The basic principle taken into account in selecting an area is the risk of the remains being disturbed by fishing or other operations, which rules out all of the Firth of Clyde now, and, I'd have thought, historically.

Another aspect to be taken into account is whether or not a Scottish minister would have been prepared to conduct a burial service involving, by definition, unconsecrated "ground".

Note that the disposal, i.e. scattering, of ashes at sea is quite a different matter.

David

Post by **emanday** » Fri Apr 20, 2007 2:43 pm

True, these days. The one I attended was at the Isle of Wight site.

Still, I'm not sure if environmental issues were an

issue

in 1879.

DavidWW · Post by **DavidWW** » Fri Apr 20, 2007 3:22 pm

emanday wrote:True, these days. The one I attended was at the Isle of Wight site.

Still, I'm not sure if environmental issues were an issue in 1879.

Mibbees aye, mibbee naw, but Ah jist hae ma doots aboot a kirk meenister bein' content daeing an "interment" oot in Ayr Bay.

David