Bellaghy / Co. Londonderry

Northern Ireland and Eire

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Rockford
Posts: 263
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2007 11:11 pm
Location: North Lanarkshire

Bellaghy / Co. Londonderry

Post by Rockford » Wed Feb 24, 2010 10:06 pm

Hi,

I was wondering if we have any TS members in the Bellaghy / Magherafelt / Castledawson areas?

I'm trying to establish where my Burnside / Allen ancestors may have been buried. They lived near Bellaghy and were presbyterians. I've been in contact with the St Tida's Church of Ireland, Ballyscullion Parish, which covers Bellaghy and which has a cemetery, but they're no' in there..... Does anyone know of other burial places nearby that may be more likely?

All help and comments welcome!

Best wishes

Brian
SMITH - Luss/Lanarkshire
BURNSIDE - Londonderry/Lothian
SWEENEY - Donegal/Monklands
GILCHRIST - Lanark/Lothians/Peebles
HUNTER/GWYNNE - Monklands/Fife/Stirling
LOGIE/DUNLOP/YOUNG/THOMSON - Lothian

Liz Turner
Global Moderator
Posts: 661
Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2006 11:28 pm
Location: Renfrewshire, Scotland

Re: Bellaghy / Co. Londonderry

Post by Liz Turner » Thu Feb 25, 2010 10:05 pm

Brian

Unless I'm mistaken, Presbyterian is not Church of Ireland, so you'd be very unlllikely to find them in a C of I cemetery!

I did a search and came up with a few links to the Presbyterian Church at Bellaghy and some other links:-

"If you are looking for a Presbyterian Church in Ulster this site lists all the Churches in counties Antrim, Armagh, Cavan, Donegal, Down, Fermanagh, Londonderry, Monaghan and Tyrone. It also indicates where the records can be found ie the Public Records Office (PRONI), Presbyterian Historical Society (PHS) or retained by the local congregation, and where applicable it also includes the PRONI References for the records."

http://georgemcintyre.tripod.com/id8.html

http://www.libraryireland.com/UlsterDirectory191ught i0/Bellaghy.php

http://northwestwarmemorials.com/memori ... an-church/

I'd read your post earlier tonight, but it was only when I went searching for my own Scots Presbyterians in Ballyeaston, that I found these sites, and thought I'd come back and post them.

If you've already seen them, apologies - but from experience I appreciate how hard it is to find information regarding Irish relatives!

Maybe someone else on TS can come up with other suggestions.

Cheers!

Lizz - must go for a refreshment - I can't even get my name right!

Liz
Fife: Nicolson, Cornfoot, Walker, Gibson, Balsillie, Galt, Elder
NE Scot: Nicolson, Lindsay, Haliburton, Ross
Edin & Central: Nicolson, Blaikie, Stevenson, Ross, Hotchkiss, Suttie, Christie, Clelland, Gray, Purvis, Lang, Dickson
Ross & Cromarty: Ross

Rockford
Posts: 263
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2007 11:11 pm
Location: North Lanarkshire

Re: Bellaghy / Co. Londonderry

Post by Rockford » Fri Feb 26, 2010 1:44 pm

Hi Liz,

Thanks for the link suggestions - I've seen the George McIntyre one before, but not the others.

I have the address of the Bellaghy Presbyterian Church, but I think I was just hoping that they have a website listing all my long lost rellies :) or that someone would pop and say, "Burnside gravestones, I've got photographs of them all......."!!

It might have to wait until I arrange to finally visit.

I agree that Presbyterian isn't Church of Ireland, although the Ballyscullion Parish website did seem to indicate that thay may still have been in their cemetery. I've been in recent ontact with the Secretary who advises that they are not. There is one Burnside stone from much later, but I can't yet connect them to my lot.

I've managed to make some inroads to my Irish Presbyterians, but as for the Donegal lot..... :roll: Fortunately (as far as records go) some of my Irish relations came to Scotland or went to the States, so I've been able to glean bits from later certificates t/here.

Thanks

Brian
SMITH - Luss/Lanarkshire
BURNSIDE - Londonderry/Lothian
SWEENEY - Donegal/Monklands
GILCHRIST - Lanark/Lothians/Peebles
HUNTER/GWYNNE - Monklands/Fife/Stirling
LOGIE/DUNLOP/YOUNG/THOMSON - Lothian

Elwyn
Posts: 2
Joined: Sat Aug 21, 2010 2:03 pm

Re: Bellaghy / Co. Londonderry

Post by Elwyn » Mon Aug 30, 2010 10:34 am

Brian,

In your first post you asked if there were any members in the Bellaghy area. I live quite close to Bellaghy.

You appear to have eliminated the COI graveyard but did you ever establish whether there are Burnsides or Allens in the Presbyterian churchyard? If you want me to look, I'll do that for you.


Elwyn

Rockford
Posts: 263
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2007 11:11 pm
Location: North Lanarkshire

Re: Bellaghy / Co. Londonderry

Post by Rockford » Mon Aug 30, 2010 1:05 pm

Hi Elwyn,

Welcome to TalkingScot and thank you for your generous offer!

I haven't managed to find out if there are any relations in the Presbyterian churchyard and had assumed that it would need to wait for the visit that I've been hoping to make for several years. If you were able to provide any assistance, it would be appreciated.

My great great grandparents were John Burnside & Sarah Allen, who married in March 1859 at Bellaghy First Presbyterian Church. John was the son of William Burnside, while Sarah was the daughter of Alexander Allen. Both families farmed at Killyberry from at least the 1860s through to at least the early 1930s.

From the date of their marriage, when they were both described as being 'of full age', John and Sarah must have been born in the 1830s. From two will/intestate documents I received from PRONI, I believe that John Burnside may have died in 1908 and Sarah's brother, Alexander jnr, may have died in 1911. I think there was also another brother, Hugh, although I know that there may be more.

My great-grandfather, John Burnside jnr, was already in Scotland by 1891 and at least one brother and sister were in the USA by the same time. There was, however, another brother Robert Burnside, who I think I have found in Killyberry in 1911, with his wife Lizzie McLelland and his mother Sarah.

If you were able to provide any help at all, I would be very grateful, although please do not go out of your way for me.

I'm not using my own PC just now, but I'll edit this post later to put in some birthdates and other details.

Best wishes

Brian
SMITH - Luss/Lanarkshire
BURNSIDE - Londonderry/Lothian
SWEENEY - Donegal/Monklands
GILCHRIST - Lanark/Lothians/Peebles
HUNTER/GWYNNE - Monklands/Fife/Stirling
LOGIE/DUNLOP/YOUNG/THOMSON - Lothian

Elwyn 1
Posts: 179
Joined: Sun Sep 05, 2010 8:34 pm
Location: Co. Antrim, Ireland

Re: Bellaghy / Co. Londonderry

Post by Elwyn 1 » Sun Sep 05, 2010 9:04 pm

Brian,

I had a look at Bellaghy Presbyterian Church. The church was built in 1838. As you may know it is immediately beside the COI church. The Presbyterian Ch does not have any obvious graveyard. So I phoned the Minister – Rev Jonathan Sloan (028 79386490) who was very helpful. He told me that there is no graveyard and all his congregation are buried in the COI graveyard (confirming what you have been told previously).

In one of your posts you mentioned Bellaghy First Presbyterian Church (which normally indicates that there is/was more than one Presbyterian Congregation in the locality). So I asked about this. He told me that until the 1920s there had been 2 Presbyterian congregations in Bellaghy but they had then combined, and since then there has only been the one. Both congregations have always used the COI graveyard for burials.

More recently, Bellaghy Pres Church has combined with Knockloughrim Pres Church, which does have its own graveyard, and that graveyard is still used for those from that area, but he was not aware of any Bellaghy people being buried in Knockloughrim.

I had a look around the COI graveyard. It is not very big, and all available space seems to be in use. There are of course some graves where the writing is indecipherable. The only Burnside or Allen grave I could see is that to James Burnside who died 30.8.1953 and his wife Charlotte who d 20.10.1974 but I think you already have that.

So either your Burnside/Allen ancestors are in unmarked or indecipherable graves in the COI church, or they were buried somewhere else.

Sorry not to be able to give you more interesting information. You might want to speak to the Minister yourself to see if he is able to put you in touch with any current Burnside/Allen members that you may not know about. Or he might have some ideas about other burial places if they are not in the COI cemetery.


Elwyn

Rockford
Posts: 263
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2007 11:11 pm
Location: North Lanarkshire

Re: Bellaghy / Co. Londonderry

Post by Rockford » Wed Sep 08, 2010 6:20 pm

Hi Elwyn,

Thank you for your investigations on my behalf, which are greatly appreciated!

Now I know why I had no success in finding the Presbyterian churchyard - there not being one would definitely make it difficult :) It definitely seems as though my folks will be in the CoI cemetery. I had hoped for a stone to confirm some of the information I don't have, but perhaps as they were tenants rather than owning the land themselves money was spent on other things as was the case for many of my Scottish relations.

I don't know if/where James and Charlotte fit in, although I do have a photo of their gravestone from the person I contacted at St Tida's Church of Ireland. He didn't imply that there would be much information held by them about any Presbyterians buried in their churchyard, so I'll need to keep digging :shock: in other places!

Best wishes

Brian
SMITH - Luss/Lanarkshire
BURNSIDE - Londonderry/Lothian
SWEENEY - Donegal/Monklands
GILCHRIST - Lanark/Lothians/Peebles
HUNTER/GWYNNE - Monklands/Fife/Stirling
LOGIE/DUNLOP/YOUNG/THOMSON - Lothian

Helene
Posts: 4
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2010 12:05 am

Re: Bellaghy / Co. Londonderry

Post by Helene » Wed Nov 10, 2010 1:17 am

Hi Brian

It seems that your Great Grandfather's brother was married to my Great Grandfather's sister! My ancestor was Lizzie McClelland who married Robert Burnside of Killyberry (the pair you found in the 1911 census) The 1901 census of Killyberry has John Burnside, aged 60, farmer, wife Sarah, aged 65, and their son Robert, aged 30, farmer. So it looks like these are your people.

Robert Burnside is buried at Castledawson Presbyterian Church. I'm afraid I don't know where his parents are buried but it is very possible that they were associated with the same church.

I hope this little piece of the jigsaw is useful.

Helen

Elwyn 1
Posts: 179
Joined: Sun Sep 05, 2010 8:34 pm
Location: Co. Antrim, Ireland

Re: Bellaghy / Co. Londonderry

Post by Elwyn 1 » Wed Nov 10, 2010 1:40 pm

Brian,

Would you like me to check out Castledawson Presbyterian graveyard for Burnside & Allen gravestones?


Elwyn

Rockford
Posts: 263
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2007 11:11 pm
Location: North Lanarkshire

Re: Bellaghy / Co. Londonderry

Post by Rockford » Wed Nov 10, 2010 7:09 pm

Hi Helene,

Thank you for your post - it's always nice to meet a new cousin! :D

I have a likely Will record from 1908 for John Burnside, so I agree that the 1901 Census with John, Sarah and Robert means that the 1911 Census with Robert, Lizzie and Robert's mother Sarah are my folks.

My grandmother was the youngest of 14 children and nearly 25 years younger than her oldest sibling. She can remember visiting Killyberry in the 1930s when she was very young, although she isn't sure who she met. I assume that her grandmother, Sarah, may have died by then, so it's possible that it was Robert and Lizzie that she stayed with (although I suppose it could have been the Allens). I also know that one of her brothers spent time recuperating in Ireland after a household accident and was accompanied by one of the older sisters. I assume that this again have been some time in the 1930s.

I know nothing about Robert and Lizzie beyond the 1911 Census record - which I was able to use to pinpoint their marriage on EmeraldAncestors. Do you have any information about them that you would be happy to share? I think that given the ages of Robert and Lizzie when they married, they were maybe unlikely to have had a family, and the contact I had with the George McIntyre site indicated that there aren't any Burnsides there now, although apparently there are still some Allens.

I agree that it's quite a jigsaw and every piece is appreciated!

Hi Elwyn,

Again, thank you for your generosity. If you were able to have a root around Castledawson, it would be appreciated. Don't put yourself out in this 'autumnal' weather and dark nights, though. I've waited this long, I'm sure I can last a wee bit longer!

Best wishes to you both,

Brian
SMITH - Luss/Lanarkshire
BURNSIDE - Londonderry/Lothian
SWEENEY - Donegal/Monklands
GILCHRIST - Lanark/Lothians/Peebles
HUNTER/GWYNNE - Monklands/Fife/Stirling
LOGIE/DUNLOP/YOUNG/THOMSON - Lothian

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