Semple, Kilbarchan.....

Kathy · Post by **Kathy** » Mon Feb 19, 2007 10:59 pm

My research is now back in the 1700's, but I'm a bit stuck, now that I am past the census years, I don't really know how to proceed.

I have the OPR for Agnes Semple b 1796 Kilbarchan, lawful daughter of William Semple & Jane Fowlis.

I have located two other siblings, Janet b 1793 Kilbarchan & William b 1780 Kilbarchan.

On the OPR of Agnes, her father William Semple is a workman in Kilbarchan, I assume he originates from elsewhere. I have not been able to find a marriage for William & Jane Fowlis.

William & Jane's three children born Kilbarchan between 1780 & 1796, would William still be considered a worker, and not of this parish

Where do I proceed from here?

Kathy

Russell · Post by **Russell** » Tue Feb 20, 2007 1:54 am

Hi kathy

Would it be possible to post the register page up here?
I'm surprised at the description 'worker'. Kilbarchan folk usually had specific skills either linked to weaving or to agriculture where a job description would be used.
Other people not connected with either craft were specific tradesmen, agents or merchants.
Since I live in the village it also adds to my local knowledge.
There might be clues to which part of the village they were from.

Russell

Kathy · Post by **Kathy** » Tue Feb 20, 2007 4:58 am

Hi Russell

File now in Gallery.

http://talkingscot.com/gallery/displayi ... ?pos=-1063

Kathy

Gallery url added by Marilyn

Russell · Post by **Russell** » Tue Feb 20, 2007 1:37 pm

Hello Kathy

Thanks for posting the entry.
It is fascinating because more than half of the names are linked to families who are still living in, or around Kilbarchan.

William Semple was almost definitely from Kilbarchan. The family name is still extant although now in Johnstone and Bridge of Weir (neighbouring townships).
The other entries where the occupation is 'Wr' are/were all weavers so the 'workman' entry was clear to define his occupational position in a village community. He was probably what might be called now, a 'day labourer' capable of doing a wide variety of tasks to assist the various other tradesmen in the village. At that time there were bleachfields, candlemaking factories, general and weavers merchants, carters, all working in the village.

A friend who saw your post suggested that you broaden your approach to spelling williams and Jane's surnames.
Semple can be found as Sempil/Sempill/Semphill/Simpil in older records.
Jane -could equally be recorded as Jean - might be Faulds/Fauldes/Fowles/Fowlis/Foulis/Fowlds
You have to be a bit inventive thinking up possible variants for the name then think how they might sound with a broad accent.
about the other names
Carruth is still a local farming name.
The Barr family used to own a grocer shop and another branch were haulage contractors and coal merchants.
Limond has modified and become Lamont.
There is a poster on TS who is distantly related to the McIntyres who still live in the village.
You never know. You might still have distant links to folks still living here

Russell

Kathy · Post by **Kathy** » Tue Feb 20, 2007 1:59 pm

Hi Russell,

I had thought of searching for variations on the name, but with the older records giving so little lateral information, how can I be sure I have the correct person/family.

It would seem that discovery is more hit & miss prior to 1800, especially with first names being used repeatedly, I cant tell you how many William, Alexander & James I have, luckily some of them have middle names, which give at least a direction to persue.

Kathy

Russell · Post by **Russell** » Tue Feb 20, 2007 3:15 pm

Hi Kathy

One thing to keep in mind while you search is that many Scots families followed a traditional naming pattern for their children and by collating as many sets of names from the same place over a given time period it can allow you to put together the families of brothers, at least from a family.
We had this to do with a family in Ayrshire. eventually we had three sets of children with almost identical naming patterns. What set them apart was the use of grandparents names at the beginning of each set of children. This allowed us to go back a generation and go through the same process with the siblings of the previous generation.
We currently have a family link from 1770's in Kirkcudbrightshire where the naming pattern matches those we have identified clearly 2 generations further on but no records appear to exist to allow us to make the bridge between the early names and the later ones. Frustrating since they all are found at the same address, Stroanfreggan.- A tiny cluster of houses high in the hills.
Even if a record does not appear to tie in with your current information but is from the same place. Keep it, look for every tiny clue it may hold and months, even years later you may find the connection which firmly ties it in.

Russell

Post by **emanday** » Tue Feb 20, 2007 3:58 pm

Russell wrote:snipped...

Even if a record does not appear to tie in with your current information but is from the same place. Keep it, look for every tiny clue it may hold and months, even years later you may find the connection which firmly ties it in.

I couldn't agree more, Russell. I have one family with a very unusual name in a very small area in Ayrshire where the naming patterns in the 1600's/early 1700's clearly matches the later naming patterns, but there is over a ninety year gap.

I have an idea that this is more to do with the multiple spellings of the surname and also transcriptions of, let's face it, some very questionable handwriting, than the possibility that they debunked en masse for 90 years and then returned en masse

Russell · Post by **Russell** » Tue Feb 20, 2007 5:10 pm

Hi Kathy

Another TalkingScot has been doing some digging on IGI and came up with:
William SEMPLE (father James) married Jean FAULDS (father James) 23 Jan 1773 Renfrew, Renfrewshire

In Renfrew they had:
John 1773 (Jean's name as FAULDS)
And in Kilbarchan they had:
Jane 1776 (her name as FOULIS)
Margaret 1778 (Jean's name as FOULDS)
William 1780 (changed again- name as FOWLIS)
male 1783 (name recorded as FOULIS)
Robert 1786 (name as FOULIS)
Mary 1780 (name as FOULIS)
Janet 1793 (now she's FOWLIS)
Faulds is a Renfrewshire name and Neilston, Renfrew and Kilbarchan are all within a reasonable days walking distance of each other so it looks like they actually had a larger family than just the two you found.
When you look at some of the old records it is easy to see why a modern reader would mis-transcribe an entry.
Looks like that OPR download paid off.

Russell

Edited once Should have looked at your avatar first As a Buddie you already know where the parishes are

Kathy · Post by **Kathy** » Tue Feb 20, 2007 9:27 pm

Hi Russell,

Even though I was born in Paisley, Mossvale St, right next to the Kibble, delivered by my grandmother, I cant claim to be a Buddie. For my first 11 years we lived in Port Glasgow, my father being a rivitter.

At aged 11 our family migrated to Australia, I rely on a reasonably good memory, an atlas, and kind people pointing me in the right direction, plus Google World to give the perspective of where I'm looking.

Thanks for the IGI listing, I will digest and see what it can tell me, I have to admit, to this point I have not used the naming pattern, its certainly worth taking in to consideration.

Kathy