Looking for John Campbell Thompson

[SarahND]

Hello again,
Annie's parents were Edmond and Mary according to the online tree, so that throws things off a bit in terms of naming pattern, there being no son Edmond, and Mary being the third daughter, rather than the first. The nickname Fanny is more English and Irish than it is Scottish. The name Alfred is also very rare in Scotland at that time. They may be just a reflection of the fact that Annie was Irish, or... John's family may have been living in England or Ireland and he may have been born there.

These are the children given in the tree:

Elizabeth "Isabel" 1867 Santa Catarina, Brasil
Frances "Fanny" 1868 San Javier, Prov. Santa Fé
William (no birth information, do you have any?)
Alfred 1874 Rosario, Prov. Santa Fé
Mary "Polly" 1876 Rosario, Prov Santa Fé

I found Alfred in the 1895 Argentina Census on FamilySearch:
Alfredo Thompson, age 20 is single and living in Rosario

I am well aware of the problem trying to find John's parents and birthplace, having spent years trying and failing to take my Stewart ancestors back to Scotland. Until you have exhausted all possible resources in North and South America, looking for his birth in Scotland is like trying to find a particular needle in a large haystack! And you won't know for sure it is him even if you do find him! (Unless you can find a newspaper account of him being in Argentina-- now there's a good idea!)

You may have to also consider that he may not have been actually born in Scotland. It is fairly common to find family stories about origin that collapse several generations. One of my great great great grandmothers was referred to in the county history as a "Scottish lass." So far I have found that she, her parents and her grandparents were all born in America… so the Scottish connection keeps going farther and farther back!
Reminds me of my mother-in-law who used to speak of the "English" people in certain parts of France, whose ancestors came from England during the 100 years war (which took place from 1337 to 1453)! But they are still "English" to her...

All the best,
Sarah

[robertoestela]

A few more links that might interest you, if you haven't already seen them:

Someone has posted your family on irishgenealogy.com
http://www.irishgenealogy.com.ar/geneal ... /John7.php


Javier L. Maffucci Moore has written a paper called:
"Crisis e inmigración. Los efectos de la debacle de 1873-1876 en algunas colonias del nordeste santafesino"

http://www.historiaymemoria.com.ar/webhym/2/2a.doc

John Campbell Thompson is mentioned in footnote 91, which gives some of the same information you did, so I expect you have read the paper:

91 De los pobladores originales Thomas Moses Moore permaneció en Colonia California hasta fines del siglo XIX cuando se trasladó definitivamente a Alejandra, Josiah Carico Reeves se instaló en Romang hacia 1888, Robert Waspe retornó a Sudáfrica, y lo mismo ocurrió con Joseph J. Beckley (h) tras estar algún tiempo en Alejandra, donde quedó su padre Joseph, John Campbell Thompson que vivió cuatro años en la Colonia California, y luego en Alejandra, se radicó finalmente en Rosario, Francis Benitz volvió a los Estados Unidos pero regresó en 1874 junto con su hermano Guillermo y toda su familia para instalarse en Las Rosas, Rachel Ann Holman, la viuda de James W. Hurt y sus hijos se radicaron en Alejandra. Alexander McLean y James B. Lockett nunca abandonaron la colonia a lo sumo se trasladaron a la vecina San Javier.

(By the way, as I struggled slowly through the Spanish, I was very interested to see the name Josiah Carico Reeves, since Josiah Carico (not a common name!) is possibly one of my great great great grandfathers (or else it was his brother Charles...) Anyway, the name leapt out at me! It just goes to prove that you never know where you will find a useful clue!)

All the best,
Sarah

HELLO SARAH !!! YOU'RE AMAZING !!!
I KNOW THIS PAPER OF JMMOORE , THIS JCT HE MENTIONS IS MY 2GG.

I ALSO KNOW THE IRISH LINK , I POSTED BECAUSE I FOUND SOME SITE ADMIN REGISTERED ELIZABETH ( 1st JCT's DAUGHTER ) MARRIAGE , SO I GAVE HIM
THE REST OF HER FAMILY, AS I KNEW.

IT'S A SMALL WORLD... I CANT BELIEVE WHAT YOU FOUND ABOUT REEVES , HERE'S A LINK , IT'S JOSHIA REEVES MARRIAGE FROM INDIANA USA BORN ABT
1831 , ACT # 32. http://www.argbrit.org/Alejandra/matrimonios.htm

ANYTHING YOU WANT ABOUT THIS JUST LET ME KNOW
REGARDS

[robertoestela]

Hello again,
Annie's parents were Edmond and Mary according to the online tree, so that throws things off a bit in terms of naming pattern, there being no son Edmond, and Mary being the third daughter, rather than the first. The nickname Fanny is more English and Irish than it is Scottish. The name Alfred is also very rare in Scotland at that time. They may be just a reflection of the fact that Annie was Irish, or... John's family may have been living in England or Ireland and he may have been born there.

These are the children given in the tree:

Elizabeth "Isabel" 1867 Santa Catarina, Brasil
Frances "Fanny" 1868 San Javier, Prov. Santa Fé
William (no birth information, do you have any?)
Alfred 1874 Rosario, Prov. Santa Fé
Mary "Polly" 1876 Rosario, Prov Santa Fé

I found Alfred in the 1895 Argentina Census on FamilySearch:
Alfredo Thompson, age 20 is single and living in Rosario

I am well aware of the problem trying to find John's parents and birthplace, having spent years trying and failing to take my Stewart ancestors back to Scotland. Until you have exhausted all possible resources in North and South America, looking for his birth in Scotland is like trying to find a particular needle in a large haystack! And you won't know for sure it is him even if you do find him! (Unless you can find a newspaper account of him being in Argentina-- now there's a good idea!)

You may have to also consider that he may not have been actually born in Scotland. It is fairly common to find family stories about origin that collapse several generations. One of my great great great grandmothers was referred to in the county history as a "Scottish lass." So far I have found that she, her parents and her grandparents were all born in America… so the Scottish connection keeps going farther and farther back!
Reminds me of my mother-in-law who used to speak of the "English" people in certain parts of France, whose ancestors came from England during the 100 years war (which took place from 1337 to 1453)! But they are still "English" to her...

All the best,
Sarah

SARAH , I SEE YOUR POINT , MAYBE I TOOK FOR GRANTED SOME FAMILY TRADITION WITHOUT A SOLID BASE.
ABOUT WILLIAM , I JUST GOT HIS BAPTISM ACT FROM ..... YOUR FINDING !!!!
HERE IS:
https://www.familysearch.org/search/rec ... A1870-1960~

BUT I KNEW ( FAMILY LETTER ) THE HE TO DODGE THE MILITAR DRAFT EMIGRATED TO ENGLAND AND JOIN THE ROYAL ENGENEERS , SERVED AT SIERRA LEONE
AND HONG KONG, AND RETIRED AT CHATHAM,ENGLAND. ACCORDIND TO BAPT.DATA HIS ENGLISH NAME WAS WILLIAM EDWARD.

THIS ARGENTINIAN HISTORIAN JMMOORE SENT ME A TRANSCRIPTION OF A BRITISH ( ARG ) JOURNAL "THE STANDARD" , SEPT 11 , 1873 , JOHN THOMPSON WAS IN BUENOS AIRES IN TRANSIT TO ENGLAND TO GET BRITISH INMIGRANTS TO ALEXANDRA COLONY , I SUPPOSE IN THOSE CIRCUMSTANCES JCT AND WIFE DECIDED TO HAVE FRANCES AND WILLIAM BAPTISED , BUT IN A CATHOLIC (SAN NICOLAS DE BARI) CHURCH ???? I AM HAVING MY DOUBTS .... I GOT ANNE'S BAPTISM ACT , SHE WAS A ROMAN CATH. I SUPPOSED JCT TO BE A PROTESTANT , BUT I DONT KNOW ... IT'S CONFUSING SINCE BUENOS AIRES HAD ANGLICAN AND PRESBYTERIAN CHURCHES .... MAYBE WAS A MATTER OF TIME , THEY WERE LEAVING BUENOS AIRES TO ENGLAND AND THAT CHURCH WAS HANDY. OR CHEAPER ? WHO KNOWS...

ALFRED EMIGRATED TO SANTIAGO , CHILE AND SETTLE THERE , HAVE A DAUGHTER OLIVIA, BUT I DONT KNOW WHEN HAPPENED THIS EVENTS.

[robertoestela]

Hi again Roberto,
I've been working on this on and off all day, with nothing brilliant to report, but a few things to say Sorry, it's an occupational hazard since I was a university professor First some good news as requested:

The birth of Aunt Fanny is found on the Family Search site. Go to familysearch.org and put francesa as a first name and thomson as a surname, place of birth: Argentina, year 1873 and it will come right up. Of course, that's not how I found it since I didn't know any of that information. This is the only record I have seen with the Scots spelling Thomson and I am quite relieved to see it! Thompson with a "p" is more likely to be English or Irish. Either he was illiterate and so left the spelling up to others, or his family was English or Irish or American for more than one generation after leaving Scotland. That makes it confusing also! He could well have been born in England, Ireland or America of Scottish parents. Help!

The tree I saw is on Ancestry.com. so I'm not sure you can access it if you don't have a subscription, but give it a try:
http://trees.ancestry.com/tree/23650634 ... 5504?ssrc=

I have sent you the name of the tree owner in a pm. She is probably a relative of yours and perhaps someone you already know.

She also has another tree that says John was born in 1832 (-1875)
Anne Foley 1839-1929 dau pf Edmond Foley & Mary Muleahy
The page for John C Thompson has all sorts of records, which may or may not be for the same person:

1) Arrival in San Francisco 1851: no middle initial, no age or origin (don't think this can be the right person)
2) Arrival in NY on the "Vigo" 16 Sep 1858:
John C Thompson, 25, Labourer, from "Great Britain"
Joseph Thompson, 18, Labourer, from "Great Britain"
This one looks more likely

3) Naturalization in the Maine, Mass, New Hamp & Vermont district (Worcester, Mass)
John Thompson
Birth date 27 Jun 1831, Ireland
Date of action: 8 Sep 1860
Possible, but doesn't fit with the passenger list, nor does it have the middle initial.

4) Census for 1860 in Cairo, Illinois (same as the one I found and mentioned in another post) Doesn't fit with the naturalization in the NorthEast.

5) Civil War record for the Confederate army for John C Thompson: Not at all obvious to me that this is your John. There are actually quite a few Civil War records for a John C Thom(p)son, so I see no reason why this should be "the one." Have you also heard that he fought in the Civil War in the United States? If so, it might be worth looking at those other records in detail. There are a number in different states and different sides of the war.

More later as I get it organized...

Regards,
Sarah

SARAH , YOU'RE RIGHT , IT A PAID SITE , ANYWAY PLEASE SEND ME AGAIN THIS NAME , I COULDNT FIND THIS:
"I have sent you the name of the tree owner in a pm. She is probably a relative of yours and perhaps someone you already know."

I WOULD APPRECIATE ANY ADDITIONAL INFO YOU COULD FIND AND SHARE WITH ME.
BEST REGARDS,
ROBERTO

[robertoestela]

Hi again Roberto,
I've been working on this on and off all day, with nothing brilliant to report, but a few things to say Sorry, it's an occupational hazard since I was a university professor First some good news as requested:

The birth of Aunt Fanny is found on the Family Search site. Go to familysearch.org and put francesa as a first name and thomson as a surname, place of birth: Argentina, year 1873 and it will come right up. Of course, that's not how I found it since I didn't know any of that information. This is the only record I have seen with the Scots spelling Thomson and I am quite relieved to see it! Thompson with a "p" is more likely to be English or Irish. Either he was illiterate and so left the spelling up to others, or his family was English or Irish or American for more than one generation after leaving Scotland. That makes it confusing also! He could well have been born in England, Ireland or America of Scottish parents. Help!

The tree I saw is on Ancestry.com. so I'm not sure you can access it if you don't have a subscription, but give it a try:
http://trees.ancestry.com/tree/23650634 ... 5504?ssrc=

I have sent you the name of the tree owner in a pm. She is probably a relative of yours and perhaps someone you already know.

She also has another tree that says John was born in 1832 (-1875)
Anne Foley 1839-1929 dau pf Edmond Foley & Mary Muleahy
The page for John C Thompson has all sorts of records, which may or may not be for the same person:

1) Arrival in San Francisco 1851: no middle initial, no age or origin (don't think this can be the right person)
2) Arrival in NY on the "Vigo" 16 Sep 1858:
John C Thompson, 25, Labourer, from "Great Britain"
Joseph Thompson, 18, Labourer, from "Great Britain"
This one looks more likely

3) Naturalization in the Maine, Mass, New Hamp & Vermont district (Worcester, Mass)
John Thompson
Birth date 27 Jun 1831, Ireland
Date of action: 8 Sep 1860
Possible, but doesn't fit with the passenger list, nor does it have the middle initial.

4) Census for 1860 in Cairo, Illinois (same as the one I found and mentioned in another post) Doesn't fit with the naturalization in the NorthEast.

5) Civil War record for the Confederate army for John C Thompson: Not at all obvious to me that this is your John. There are actually quite a few Civil War records for a John C Thom(p)son, so I see no reason why this should be "the one." Have you also heard that he fought in the Civil War in the United States? If so, it might be worth looking at those other records in detail. There are a number in different states and different sides of the war.

More later as I get it organized...

Regards,
Sarah

SARAH , THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR HELP AND YOUR TIME , BY THE WAY ANYTHING YOU'RE INTERESTED IN BRITISH EMIGRANTS IN ARGENTINA IF I COULD HELP , JUST MENTION IT. IF YOU PREFER OR IS EASIER FOR YOU AN EMAIL JUST TELL ME.

BEST REGARDS,
ROBERTO.

[SarahND]

SARAH , YOU'RE RIGHT , IT A PAID SITE , ANYWAY PLEASE SEND ME AGAIN THIS NAME , I COULDNT FIND THIS:
"I have sent you the name of the tree owner in a pm. She is probably a relative of yours and perhaps someone you already know."

At the top of this page, in the upper left, click on "User Control Panel." There will be a tab called "private messages" and my message should be in your inbox.
Otherwise, you should have received an email saying that you got a private message with a link to go directly to it. Maybe this email got caught in your spam filter?

Regards,
Sarah

[SarahND]

ABOUT WILLIAM , I JUST GOT HIS BAPTISM ACT FROM ..... YOUR FINDING !!!!

Very good! The name Guillermo Eduardo Campbell Thomson not only is another example of Thompson without the 'p'-- which is encouraging-- but also we have Anne's father represented with the "Eduardo." So perhaps he was named for both grandfathers.

Regards,
Sarah

[robertoestela]

Hi again,
I have been trying to follow the clue you gave in one of your lasts posts, i.e. that they saw President Lincoln lying in state after his death, so perhaps they were living in the Washington, DC area? You mentioned Philadelphia (not too far from Washington, DC)-- what is your reason for that? Sorry to keep asking questions, but there are so many John C Thom(p)sons that we have to find some way of finding out which one he was. I am beginning to think that finding the marriage record may well be the key to the whole mystery.

Oh no I had a vague memory from my school days of hearing about the funeral train of Abraham Lincoln, so googled and just read here: http://awesometalks.wordpress.com/2008/ ... m-lincoln/
That the body of Lincoln was taken by rail from Washington, DC to Springfield, Illinois for burial.

"During the 1,654 mile, 13 day trek, the train traveled through 180 towns and cities, of which only 11 were allowed to host open-casket viewings."
The eleven cities where your ancestors may have seen Lincoln are:
1.   Baltimore, Maryland
2.   Harrisburg, Pennsylvania
3.   Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
4.   New York City, New York
5.   Albany, New York
6.   Buffalo, New York
7.   Cleveland, Ohio
8.   Columbus, Ohio
9.   Indianapolis, Indiana
10.  Chicago, Illinois
11.  Springfield, Illinois

The train left Washington on April 21, 1865 and arrived in Springfield on May 3rd. John C Thompson and Annie Foley were married in April of that year. So… their marriage probably occurred in one of those 11 cities, or nearby to one of them. I have so far searched just about every marriage record available online and have not found them. The good news is that more records are being put online every day and perhaps, with a bit of luck, the marriage will come online soon and, with yet more luck, will make some reference to the actual birthplace of John, or his parents' names. Many later marriage records will have this information, but at that date it would be a matter of luck. We will all keep our fingers crossed and hope!

Because of the 1860 census record, I first checked Illinois. The Illinois Statewide Marriage Index is an ongoing project that is not yet completed for all counties. Can't find them there yet...
http://www.cyberdriveillinois.com/depar ... riage.html

Regards,
Sarah

HI SARAH !, AS YOU SAY I POSTED PHILADELPHIA BECAUSE OF THE FUNERAL TRAIN, FIRST I SUPPOSED NYC , SINCE ANNE WAS FROM IRELAND AND MANY IRISH PEOPLE LIVED THERE. THEN I LOOKED FOR A CIVIL MARRIAGE AT NYC DORIS ( DEPT OF REGISTRATION AND INFO SERVICES ) BUT UNSUCCESSFUL. ALSO FOUND OUT THAT CIVIL MARRIAGE WERE NOT OFTEN HAPPENED THAT TIME. THE THING IS NYC HAD A LOT OF CHURCHES , I EMAILED A BUNCH OF PRESB.CHURCHES , SOME REPLIED WITH NO RESULT.

REGARDS,
ROBERTO

[SarahND]

IT'S A SMALL WORLD... I CANT BELIEVE WHAT YOU FOUND ABOUT REEVES , HERE'S A LINK , IT'S JOSHIA REEVES MARRIAGE FROM INDIANA USA BORN ABT 1831 , ACT # 32. http://www.argbrit.org/Alejandra/matrimonios.htm

This is fascinating! Imagine my great grandmother's cousin Josiah at age 52, marrying an 18 year old Swiss girl Well, my great grandmother married (and divorced) three times so there was something in the blood... I've been reading up on the California Colony, etc. and it makes very interesting reading.

I'm wondering whether your John C Thompson was in California also, before going to Argentina, but that doesn't fit in with him seeing Lincoln's body. He may have been there earlier, then came east again to get married before they left the US. Don't you wish that your ancestor was named something like Josiah Carrico instead of John Thompson?! So much easier to find!

Have you seen a death record for John C Thompson? Just wondering whether it gives his birthplace as sometimes they do. Otherwise I guess we're stuck with trying to find their marriage in all of the 11 possible places. Sounds like a road trip is in order...

All the best,
Sarah

[robertoestela]

IT'S A SMALL WORLD... I CANT BELIEVE WHAT YOU FOUND ABOUT REEVES , HERE'S A LINK , IT'S JOSHIA REEVES MARRIAGE FROM INDIANA USA BORN ABT 1831 , ACT # 32. http://www.argbrit.org/Alejandra/matrimonios.htm

This is fascinating! Imagine my great grandmother's cousin Josiah at age 52, marrying an 18 year old Swiss girl Well, my great grandmother married (and divorced) three times so there was something in the blood... I've been reading up on the California Colony, etc. and it makes very interesting reading.

I'm wondering whether your John C Thompson was in California also, before going to Argentina, but that doesn't fit in with him seeing Lincoln's body. He may have been there earlier, then came east again to get married before they left the US. Don't you wish that your ancestor was named something like Josiah Carrico instead of John Thompson?! So much easier to find!

Have you seen a death record for John C Thompson? Just wondering whether it gives his birthplace as sometimes they do. Otherwise I guess we're stuck with trying to find their marriage in all of the 11 possible places. Sounds like a road trip is in order...

All the best,
Sarah

HELLO Sarah ! I cant believe this J C Reeves finding ... but it seems he was no fool , ha ha.
I have made an sketch about my 2GG history in USA , which is absolutely unconfirmed , but since I haven't any better I' ll tell you briefly :

First I found was argbrit page where many records of the Thompsons appeared. As I couldnt imagine why Elizabeth ( eldest daughter ) was born in Santa Catarina , Brazil , I started
searching for a british inmigrants in Southern Brazil.
And I found it , Colônia Príncipe Dom Pedro , in this link http://www.irlandeses.org/0607araujo4.htm

That made think they met and/or lived in NYC , and decided to take a chance in Brazil , I mean , they initially didnt plan to go to Argentina but to Brazil.
According to the link above , that colony in Brazil went down , by that time Colonia California's agent James B. Lockett was in Brazil to bring colonist to Arg. , so they decided to move to Argentina for a better chance.

This James B. Lockett was one of the founders of Col.Calif. , with Josiah Reeves among others. I took it from a JMMoore link :
http://www.santafe-conicet.gov.ar/sipar ... _moore.doc

About JCT death , from this family letter I knew that he died at 41 in Montevideo , since he travelled with his family in 1873 to get english colonists I supposed he was returning from
another travel in 1875/1876 ( before Mary's birth ). The thing is I found out in Montevideo ( very near from Buenos Aires ) in an official records but there's a gap between 1873 to 1877 , so unfortunately I had nothing there.

Well , this is what I've come up , maybe it's not the real thing but it could be , i guess , at least it makes sense.

Please any other finding you had just let me know I would appreciate it , Keep in contact ! And thank you for helping
Best Regards,
Roberto